So one of the more active threads this week at Namepros, is about naming and shaming end users who back out of deals. The thread is actually the 2.0 version due to the first thread being closed as the OP decided to dox the person they had a problem with.
There are many things to consider and some that I did not see touched upon in the thread. This was a thread about end users, not other domain investors who belong to the same community.
So my first thought was, no end user cares what a domain investor thinks of them. I know this first hand from having end users tell me they see domain investors as, pigs, scumbags, something the government will eventually do away with, bottom feeders, and a whole host of other terms.
So I can’t really see posting that the marketing director of IBM backed out of a deal carrying much weight. One of the most important things about getting riled up and spreading your word, is that people actually care.
Adam Bishop wrote an article on RiskHeads.org in which he looked at the perils of Name & Shame.
Number 3 was Nobody Cares:
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Nobody Cares
And finally, whenever you take to social media, have an idea about what you are trying to achieve when engaging.
Surely the point is to create a positive awareness of your brand, your expertise, and your trusted place in the industry. Distributing content and commentary that’s relevant, and if use and value to your audience. Enhancing your place as a thought leader in the sector.
When you use that space to declare war, or make public your aggrievances with another body, you are, at best, wasting your use of the platform. At worst, you are coming across as self-indulgent and irrelevant. Your followers and contacts simply don’t want to hear about your squabbles and troubles.
They don’t care about them and, if you shout them from the digital rooftops, there’s a real chance that they’ll stop listening to you entirely.
A name and shame rant that can be seen equally as unprofessional, ill-advised, disengaging, and nothing more than a whisper in the social media wind, from a voice that grows less relevant with every angry outcry.
It also depends where you live and where those you name and shame live. With GDPR it is probably very risky to post the name and address of a European citizen.
In South Africa for example one has to be careful
THE concept of ‘naming and shaming’ has become a popular tool on social media to expose the ‘nefarious actions’ of others. We have all seen the photos or videos of bad drivers and people parking in disabled bays.
Two years ago, dozens of residents from Durban North and surrounding areas found themselves in hot water after they allegedly posted street addresses of people who they alleged were illegally firing ‘big bangs’ over the Diwali period.
The details were posted on a popular Facebook page. One of the homeowners is said to have subsequently opened a case of defamation against these residents.
At the time the Northglen News caught up with Verlie Oosthuizen, a social media law expert at Shepstone & Wylie Attorneys in uMhlanga, to gain clarity about what social media users can ‘name and shame’.
What’s more, she said, unlike the United States, where its citizens enjoy freedom of speech (which allows them to say almost anything except ‘hate speech’), South Africa has a limited clause for its freedom of expression.
Oosthuizen urged the public to think twice before posting anything online.
“It is a dangerous game. People could find themselves fired or sued. You have to be sure that you have your facts correct, and be sure that what the person is doing is actually illegal. Sometimes something might seem illegal or unethical, but it actually is legit. ‘Public interest’ is also important. Is your content in the interest of the public?” she said.
Read the full article
On Namepros some members believe they have the right to name and shame as it is done to other businesses. Yelp being the best example. But to be fair I care a lot more about 20 people saying the pizza sucks at Giuseppe’s, a local place where I may dine, as opposed to a domain investor who dealt with a graphics design firm that backed out of one domain purchase.
Now if there was a pattern of abuse that would be another story, one would make a mental note to dismiss inquiries from that company.
Other members felt one should just move on and it’s just part of the business so no big whoop.
There are also cooling off period laws:
There are a few types of contracts that you can cancel within a few days of making the contract, mainly transactions that take place at a location that is not the seller’s permanent place (such as a trade show at a hotel), but most others you are stuck with for the duration.
There are some federal laws that allow parties to a contract to cancel or call off the contract within a few days of entering into them. These laws are often called “cooling off rules” and give the contracting parties the option of canceling a contract with a certain time period.
The contracts that fall under these rules include trade show sales contracts, contracts for home equity loans, internet purchase contracts and even door to door sales contracts. In addition, certain states have passed laws for canceling contracts that allow parties to get out of contracts for things like dating services, gym memberships and even weight loss programs.
Maybe domain investors should use Yelp, if the business has a page it could make sense to do it there, after all that would have the most weight and maybe make a company do a better job completing deals. The general public is not going to care about a small website that many don’t know.
In fact some are using Yelp against domain owners. Two scathing reviews for Mike Mann’s Domain Asset Holdings (DomainMarket.com)
Just another Cybersquatter. If there was any company that would best represent human trash, it would be this company. Seriously, if they own a domain you’ve been looking at, don’t give them money; that’s like giving money to a human child trafficker. Just find a different domain or consider legal action, which is probably cheaper. See if you can file a Uniform Domain Name Dispute Resolution Policy with ICANN.
68.8% of voters on Namepros said no to the name and shame.
Yes. But I sue all users who make offers via sedo.com and do not pay. Also transactions via escrow.com. I have a firm that has offices in the bay area, NYC Boston and various in Europe. Usually the dead beats just settle and pay, as well as pay legal. If they don’t show up for court we take the judgement. We
Yeah I am not believing a word you say. Because Sedo doesn’t even to care to follow up, and when you won did you pay Sedo their commission?
Sedo provides the contact info of all buyers who do not pay, idiot, if requested. I don’t give a fuking shite what you fuking believe.
Whether you think it’s right or wrong you can be sued for slander.
Truth is an absolute defense, and then you can sue them for malicious and abusive process.
Like most things in life, I would say “it depends”. Here’s a little industry irony for your readers, I myself was “falsely” accused of being a cybersquatter on NamePros, and trust me when I tell you, “I named names”. Verisign (vrsn), the largest publicly traded company in this space referred to domain speculators as “scalpers” and “hoaders” much to the chagrin of thousands of domainers from around the world. You might say I was vindicated, but at the risk of being called a scalper or hoarder myself.
I didn’t vote in the survey because there are always two sides to every story. I’ll be sharing more of my views on this topic at NamesCon in Vegas next month. In the interim, Happy New Year!!!
Richard aka Bulloney (re-branding to ThatNameGuy™)
If you put your Hope’s on a sale and it didnt close,I can understand the frustration but a domainer shouldnt depend on one domain so should just move on.I have had deals close to mid four figures and thought it would close but didnt hear back from buyer .I Dont know what happened to buyer but it was disappointing but soon after I closed another right after and moved on and expecting to price that unsold name higher.
Dont stress about it .If buyer doest begin processing to buy,I dont waste my time ,I just move on.
The problem is quite often you do NOT know ,really, who you are dealing with. There are a lot of fake names use, people using others names etc etc. Very risky to post what would be defamatory comment on someone without knowing 100% they were the person who backed out. Other than that I see no objection.
It really depends.
I deeply hate people who do not honor their word. Personally, I couldn’t even conceive of entering a deal and going through that whole process only to suddenly ‘change my mind’ at the end, wasting the other parties time. In this regard, my initial instinct is to say yes, nuke them… but then, I’m always dragged back to an old saying a wise man once said.
Your character will be judged- in its entirety- by the lowest and pettiest thing other people see you do… so I ask myself, what do I think about people who post histrionic laments to the internet about some business deal that went sideways? Do I think they’re professional and capable people who are ‘venting’, or do I think they’re petty losers who are emotionally unable to deal with things that didn’t go their way? Usually, the latter.
This is NOT to say that there aren’t times when putting someone on blast isn’t the right answer. Steal from me, harm me or my inner-circle, I can get meticulous, ruthless, relentless and highly creative and indeed, I have… but only in those times when I’m willing to stake my own personal reputation on the ‘justice’ I feel like I’m serving.
All time leading rusher in the NFL, Emmett Smith, used to avoid celebrations whenever he scored a touchdown. “If you get in the end zone, act like you’ve been there before…” and indeed, that’s what he did. He would punch through the defensive line, get into the end zone, score the touchdown and stoically jog off the field. He didn’t look like an emotional infant, dancing around.
It’s no secret that ‘domaining’ is infested with lowlifes, get-rich-quick types and complete losers, right among the savvy types and the insightful. If you see someone sobbing on the internet over a busted deal for a domain sale, which group do you think they belong to?
Domain THIEVES Should be named and shamed!! AND prosecuted!!
@Steve Sedo gives the info, but I doubt every action successful, the state I live in says I have the right to change my mind, (not that I would back out of a domain purchase) so do other states and countries.
Well that’s true, a lot of people just talking with no understanding of laws. And I would imagine many people don’t give their proper info when signing up at SEDO.
Sedo to seller: The buyer has reneged we have their info for you to take action if you like
Seller: If it’s binding why don’t you take action?
Sedo: Juice is not worth the squeeze. Here is the info
Hugh Jass
123 GFY Lane
Idiot, Florida 12345
Seller: You sure that’s real name?
Sedo: It’s what we got.
This is correct, Raymond. Sedo first will attempt to resolve the matter in house.then they will provide the contact info of the deadbeats. And of course the info must be correct as not many people will subpoena sedo for IP addresses or more unless you can verify significant damages. We’ve taken several non payers to court, but only when the offer was over 15 K and accepted. Also we take into consideration the location of the non-paying deadbeats. A judgement is just as good as payment as far as we’re concerned.
If it seems worth it then sue. Contract law should apply.
If it concerns personal negotiations then no you should not make the matter public. Only if it concerns others, like crimes and recurring actions that have indeed affected other parties by the same person (and therefore will continue to impact others), then and only then is it ok to make the issue public.
Some simple advice for everyday life (that someone else taught me), if you have a problem with a person you sort it out with them and never bring it up with others and don’t say things behind their back. That is cowardly because they don’t have an opportunity to defend themselves. If others are having same issues with the person you bring it up among the involved parties/group only and have everyone present whenever possible.
Depends on contractual obligations, legality and time invested.
If you choose to name and shame, you’re wasting more time that could be better spent elsewhere, especially if you get caught up in an argument online, or worse, legal action.
If you block them, or name & shame, then one thing is certain, future business dealing with them may be affected.
You might not want to deal with them in future, but money is money and you can always use past actions as part of future negotiations.
We love attorneys. They have a very pragmatic approach to finding resolutions to conflict. I’ve never regretted any amount of monies spent on counsel. We hear all the jokes about attorneys being sharks.etc. They are your best friends when dealing with unsavory predators and encroachers. I would place doctors, lawyers, teachers, firefighters and nurses among the hardest working professions in the USA.
Do you know in some regions nurses actually collide to deny shifts, and call in sick, in order for others to be able to maximie overtime. Bleeding billions from the healthcare system. Every profession works hard, but each industry has their bad apples.
Don’t give us this ba trump approach to sucking up to certain professions, unless your trying to get votes. Last I checked dogs couldn’t run, but they could probably do a more better job.
Mike I completely agree with you. Every profrssion has rotten apples and the healthcare system in the USA is ripe for corruption
Well, i do exposed the internet corruption on my website, and i even put photo of those losers! you can visit http://www.z.quebec
And, an happy new years to all domainers. Great success in 2019 coming.
Listen domainers don’t get your panties in a bunch, a domain is not sold until paid, anything youbare told before they take with a grain of salt.