Oliver Hoger has been one of the people at the heart of the discussion on Namepros with regards to NameJet bidding. Oliver posted today and gave his side of the story.
It’s an important read because it let a lot of those with less auction experience see how the big volume domainers use NameJet.
I would say start reading the replies to Oliver as well, they start here.
HI,
Sorry for delay i was traveling and cannot believe what has been said.
Everyone let me explain:
Winner888:
I have a automated bidding system that would backorder ALL the domains and bid last minute to grab bargains.
Its a script works via api would bid on all CVCV up to $2500-3000 i set daily limit on the patterns i would want to buy.On slow days i got good deals on short domains i trade in
LLLL.com / CVCV.com / LL.com / LLL.com / NNNN.com / NNNNN.com / CCC.com etc…I won allot of domains and a few of mine so this got closed down months ago already due to this..
Im trying to fix to be able to exclude all my domains.Bids that hit reserve:
We do allot of next bid wins. Most of you don’t know how this works.
My auctions have a reserve price. On the last day of the auction or in the last few hours
I see what the high bids are and then send namejet a list of domains ask to to set next bid wins.
So it is not that someone is bidding just under reserve.
I am lowering the reserve to just above the highest bid so that the next bid hits reserve and the domain will sell.
Just lowering reserve. Flippa has this same function built into their seller platform. You can reduce reserve any time.
Buyers are bidding the amount that they are willing to bid. I am not changing that.
I just lower reserve with next bid wins so that more domains sell.Regarding MediaOptions:
I have done business with them for many years on the buyer’s side, seller’s side and as a broker.Regarding HDKN:
I know HDKN and he is a big buyer of short domains, which is what I sell. I am not HDKN. I do not have access to HDKN account.
I sent him (and others) my featured listings.
All his bids and purchases are legitimate.
It has happened that I have bought some domains back from him in the past when I felt the prices were too low.I’m sorry that I have caused so much problems and confusion. I never intended to do anything that would harm anyone.
Oliver.
And it’s a lie!
What’s this ?
My auctions have a reserve price. On the last day of the auction or in the last few hours
I see what the high bids are and then send namejet a list of domains ask to to set next bid wins.
So it is not that someone is bidding just under reserve.
I am lowering the reserve to just above the highest bid so that the next bid hits reserve and the domain will sell.
Just lowering reserve. Flippa has this same function built into their seller platform. You can reduce reserve any time.
Buyers are bidding the amount that they are willing to bid. I am not changing that.
Thanks for posting this Raymond, you have knocked it out of the park this week.
Except Flippa functions COMPLETELY differently.
If there are zero bids on a Flippa auction and I bid $4000, my bid would be $1. To reach $4000, it would require 2 bidders actually bidding against each other to reach that price. And if there is fraud involved, you will see a red BANNED next to these handles.
On Namejet, if there are zero bids, HKDN, for example, can bid $4000 and the bid is now $4000.
So that is a false equivalency, especially when in many cases there is this giant bid placed on thsese auctions on Namejet and then a new reserve being posted.
NameJet needs to have proxy bids on all auctions/backorders, not just some.
I guess with all his namejet profits he can’t afford simple smart phone.
I do not think having bought more than a pair of domains at Namejet this past decade (mainly because they did not accept Paypal) so I cannot comment on anything there. But what I can say is (like most old domainers) I have purchased, sold and exchanged many short domains with Oliver Hoger and the guy has always been 100% honest. The kind of domainer who is serious and you can trust because he does this for a living and for a long time, he will not risk his reputation trying to scam you. I am not astonished to read he is using sophisticated tools to buy/sell at the best possible price because for me he has always been part of the pro and most active domainers. Many have at a moment lent a hand to a friend placing a bid or sending a domain to auction, so he probably did it himself few times but I do not see him involved in a recurrent bid shilling game. I never felt dealing with him the guy who places the love of the gain over ethic, so I hope he could prove his honesty.
Francois: I believe you when you say your dealing with Oliver in the past was honest, etc. But sometimes those same honest people that you deal with on a personal level ends up having a different persona when they believe they are cloaked from the public eye behind a username.
Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying he’s guilty at this point in time as the story has not fully unfolded.
http://ShillGate.com
I trust O-H as far as I can throw him.
I have done business with him and it was not pleasant on some of them.
Eventually, I just stopped dealing with him.
I am surprised Namejet would permit last minute bidding (bidding adjustment) as described above.
No surprise at all to see Rosener incriminated here…he gives the term dodgy a bad name.
Whilst many applaud his brokered mega deals so many remain ignorant of all his extremely dodgy practices.
Sooner or later the truth will out.
If anyone believes this total BS from Hoger then they deserve all they get.
There has been a fraudulent NJ gang for many years & it is no mystery who the main players are.
Maybe you can explain these “dodgy practices” because in ten years I have never heard a single time anyone complain about Andrew Rosener. At the inverse, as you probably know he’s part of the most successful broker and domainer. And trust me, this can only be achieved by hard work, talent, and ethic. Otherwise, there is a long time it will be out.
We all ought to be suspicious in general. Since this industry is unregulated and self-regulation is far from perfect, naturally some people are going to cheat and get away with it. Shill bidding has been documented repeatedly, year after year, at most major domain auction platforms. So we definitely know it’s happening.
Before we judge any particular person, though, it’s important to hear them out and look at all available evidence.
Domainers are frustrated by industry problems and by market dysfunction. As a result, we are sometimes overly eager to attack the big companies or the big shots. It’s fun to smash idols. Because it’s fun, we have to be self-aware and resist the temptation somewhat.
We’re unlikely to see a thorough, independent investigation. Sorry, no Robert Mueller for domainers! That means few people will get “convicted”, and just as few will get exonerated. Instead, the cloud of suspicion will hang over a lot of people and companies. That’s just the reality here. When all is said and done, all we can do is take sales and success stories with a grain of salt. And be vigilant for scoundrels.
This community is too small to begin hanging people without a fair trial. And there are no judges to oversee those trials at all – fair or otherwise. Every once in awhile, we get a clear-cut case (as we did with Adam Dicker). Usually, though, that doesn’t happen. Sketchy sellers tend to stick around. Not just stick around either. They will be the “face of the industry” for outsiders, raising awareness for the domain market in general through high-profile sales, and so forth. And alongside them, perfectly innocent people will be misjudged simply because it’s hard to tell who cheats and who doesn’t in an industry with so little accountability.
Everybody should expect to continue rubbing shoulders with everybody else. Think of it this way: The leaders of sovereign nations meet at conferences to sign treaties. They know who’s a dictator. They know that guy might be toppled tomorrow. Until then, however, they cooperate to get something done. Domain industry is corrupt in the same way. Not all leaders are corrupt, but a few of them undoubtedly are. We plug our noses, take nothing at face value, give everybody the benefit of the doubt occasionally, and carry on, cooperating with sketchy people until they overdo the cheating and go bye bye.
I’m not alluding to anybody in particular. This is just the situation for everybody who dabbles in this industry.
You are a little off base, and plenty of people are going to stop rubbing shoulders, using namejet and watching domain sherpa. You do what you like, I know what me any my friends will be doing.
How am I off base? Please explain.
Personally I haven’t watched DomainSherpa for years. Not sure what DomainSherpa has to do with any of this.
Are you really predicting that NameJet will become a ghost town – with domains selling for a fraction of their value? As we all know, domainers are more interested in righteousness than domains or money. So I’m sure that will happen.