When I woke up this morning I would never have thought I would have to write a post critical of another blogger.
Having come off the high of winning the blogger of the year award and accepting on behalf of all domain bloggers recognizing the time, work, commitment and criticism we voluntarily subject ourselves too, the LAST thing I wanted to do, especially today, is call another blogger out.
Oh well.
So I read Owen Frager’s post this morning about his experience at the TRAFFIC conference entitled simply, but brutally “TRAFFIC Sucked”, which was quickly endorsed by DomainGang.com, in its post entitled “Frager Factor calls it like it is” even though the author was NOT in attendance at TRAFFIC (confirmed with DomainGang.com).
I found Owen’s post to be internally conflictive, and very inconsistent in its statements and conclusions
Worse, actually much worse, it wasn’t just an attack on the TRAFFIC conference but on the entire domain industry.
An attack that could not go unanswered.
Owen in his post writes:
“What I witnessed was an industry defeated.”
“”Noticeably absent were many of the colorful players of the past.”
“This time it was an industry downsized.
“Vendors in booths with nothing to offer.”
“No differentiation.”
“They seem to be running on fumes.”
Owen apparently see’s the industry differently than I do.
I saw a new face in the industry on stage one who has invested over $20 million so far in the domain space and plans on investing another $20 Million next year.
His name was Stuart Lawley and he is CEO of the ICM Registry.
Yes .XXX.
Stuart by his own admission is not from the domain industry, nor is he from the adult industry.
He is a very successful self made businessman whom from very humble beginnings started a company, turned it into a public company, and cashed out for what an amount most of us could only dream of.
Stuart is a guy who could have at a young age called it a day and had a very luxurious life.
Yet Stuart decided to forgo 40 years of lying on the beach with an umbrella drink in his hand.
Stuart who could have gone into any business on earth, picked the domain business.
Stuart is excited and rightly so.
He isn’t running on fumes
Stuart is full petal to the metal just like the driver of the .XXX race boat pressing full on against choppy waters.
With ICM’s $5 Million in marketing this year, its planned $15 Million dollar spend next year added to the $10 Million .Co has spend on marketing its extension that’s $30 Million dollars in new money in the domain name industry that simply didn’t exist a year ago.
Did you happen to see the former Chairman of ICANN, Peter Dengate Thrush on stage talking about how the public company he is the Executive Director of is going to spend $10 Million dollars just in ICANN application fees to apply for 50 new Top Level Domain names?
I did
I sat next to him.
Yet Minds + Machines is just one of many very smart people I have had the honor of sitting with this year that are waiting for their chance to write a $10 Million dollar check to get into the domain name industry.
A couple of months ago I sat with a group that is investing hundreds of millions of Euro’s into the domain name business.
And that’s just to get the extensions.
There are billions of dollars entering the domain name industry.
New money, new people, new visions.
Far from a “industry defeated”
Sounds like a booming industry.
Yet Frager quickly dismisses all this new money, new investment by calling it simply a “side track”
“Once upon a time TRAFFIC was an advocate for the attendees needs. It forced companies to innovate. Now the domain industry is side tracked by the money in new extensions.”
Hey maybe the attendees of TRAFFIC just paid to figure out where the industry is heading for the next 10 years to be in front of the curve instead of playing catchup.
If you didn’t know it, if your in the domain industry, you’re in the Tech industry, an industry which is constantly changing.
If you want to be in an industry that’s going to continue to operate in the same basic way for the next 10 years, you picked the wrong industry.
Invest in a bank or an insurance company instead.
Owen says:
TRAFFIC had “Vendors in booths with nothing to offer.”
Do you really want to tell John Ferber that he is just a “Vendor in a booth with nothing to offer”
Really?
The guy who built and sold Advertising.com for $500 million and is still decades younger than myself or Owen.
John is another guy who could have called it a day, go relax on a beach for the rest of his days, but instead raised over $3M in venture capital money with a few phone calls.
John like Stuart could have went into any business he wanted to but chose the domain name industry.
John’s vision for his company DomainHoldings.com to be a game changer.
What Game does John want to change?
The same game that Owen says no one is trying to change:
“”We are at the mercy of Google because even knowing what’s coming for 10 years, no one is addressing the issue.”
DomainHoldings is addressing the issue.
They are pouring millions behind addressing the issue and have hired over 25 talented people to change it up.
Theparkingplace.com is trying too
SmartName.com, well I had three meetings with them and while I can’t tell you what they have, they have something.
Its new, different, innovative.
Will any of them change the game?
Hell I don’t know.
If I knew what Apple would be trading at a year from now I wouldn’t need to know anything else. I could just chuck all our money in and buy or short Apple stock and call it a day.
Unfortunately I don’t have a crystal ball.
But I have eyes and can see what people are trying to do.
But to say no one is trying, is completely false and insulting to those who have invested millions in changing the game.
Matter of fact, Owen just a few sentences after saying:
“We are at the mercy of Google because even knowing what’s coming for 10 years, no one is addressing the issue.”
Owen goes on to say Frank Schilling “Swept most of the (TRAFFIC) awards and deservedly so.”
“For a select group of invited participants he has improved their results and is introducing sales and marketing tools that should do a better job of closing sales than throwing your name in a list of millions.”
“One award Frank didn’t receive that he should have was for disrupting an entire industry.”
How can you say that NO ONE is addressing or trying to change the domain industry and then a few sentences later praise Mr. Schilling for doing exactly that by “disrupting an entire industry.”?
Owen goes on to say that the “The industry lacks leadership and focus at the top.”
Well what the hell do you call someone who starts a brand new business, which is able to take a substantial market share, just a couple of months after launch and “disrupts an entire industry” if not a leader?
Is that not the definition of a leader?
Yes the faces change.
Leaders become laggards.
Its a brutal economy.
People lose their jobs, companies lose there way.
Some of the companies that lead the way just a few years ago are on the verge of collapse.
This is business.
Owen goes on to say although the TRAFFIC show sucked, “”most attendees left with great return on their investment. From the new relationships they opened, existing relationships nurtured and the face time with people that would not be possible any other way. Business was done. Money will be made.”
Good return on investment.
New relationships
Business was done
Money was made
and yet it sucked?
Its clear Owen is disenchanted with the domain name business
“”Hence those with great names, but in need of cash, will call one of the big players and sell the domain for squat. And thus the once thriving wholesale market is gone. Big players with infinite capitalization can pick up domains on the cheap on the drop”
and how exactly is this the TRAFFIC show organizers fault?
Yes if you need cash and only have a watch or a guitar or a TV to your name, you might have to go to a pawn shop and take whatever your offered.
Such is life and if that’s the situation you find yourself in I’m sorry because
That’s what sucks.
Was it a perfect conference?
No.
I personally missed having a sit down lunch especially with sessions running until 7pm, when the parties starting at 8, also without sit down meals.
The auction would have been better if there was online bidding.
There are other issues we can pick at but I’ve have never ran a conference, nor do I have any desire to do so.
It’s a ton of work, planning, not to mention the expense and risk capital involved if no one shows up.
Dealing with hundreds of people and personalities all who have an opinion of how it could be run better.
On top of it all, then comes a blogger who puts up a post with a headline blaring “the show sucked” which is then picked up by Google news even though the author thought the attendees got a “great return on their investment”.
What a nightmare.
It is good to have controversy or “in-law fighting” in the domain family.
Adds more drama.
Great post Michael and I agree with you 100%. I have no idea how ANYONE who was at T.R.A.F.F.I.C. interacting with that phenomenal group of 300 or so successful entrepreneurs, could come away from it saying that it sucked. Simply mindboggling. One question I repeatedly asked various attendees as the show was nearing its end was whether or not it was productive for them. Every single one emphatically said yes and some said they made more key contacts than they imagined was possible going in. I met NO ONE who felt defeated, but a heck of a lot of people that are beyond excited about the opportunities they have in front of them.
I think the most telling line in the blog post you referred to was this one: “This headline will generate record traffic.” Yes, it will generate the traffic the writer apparently values above all else, including the truth (and “your article, though I agree it was warranted, will give him exactly what he was looking for, as will my comment here). It is just unfortunate that his gain from this grossly misleading headline comes at the expense of Rick, Howard, Alina, Barbara, Ray and Kim, who have spent the past 12 months working their asses off to put on a show that, aside from the auction, produced great results for T.RA.F.F.I.C. attendees (and that is why you will see the vast majority of those people back at the next show). In my opinion, the Schwartz and Neu families deserved a big thank you rather than a slap in the face from someone they have always treated with kindness.
Mike, the consensus is that TRAFFIC failed to produce the steam it promised.
Although I did not attend this time, I found Frager’s statements to be noteworthy as they echoed the opinions of others that summarized the results of TRAFFIC.
That’s exactly the problem with attendees that feel deprived of the promised results. Frager’s language was a bit harsh (“TRAFFIC sucked”) but it was detailed why in his opinion it did.
After reviewing the substance of his writing versus the subject, I decided to point to The Frager Factor in a short article at DomainGang.com. If someone of the “inner circle” at TRAFFIC like Owen Frager decides to write such an article, it means that his experience was strong enough to justify this.
Acro
Putting a title on your post that “Frager Factor calls it like it is” certainly implies that you agree with his assessment.
I don’t see how you can assess a conference that you did not attend.
Lol owen is a linkbaiter and unfrotunately it just worked once again.
Mike, the phrase “calls it like it is” signifies opinionated statements. I didn’t do anything beyond summarizing what Owen Frager wrote. But allow me to point to numerous blog posts in the Domaining.com timeline that echoed the same, albeit in milder language.
At DomainGang.com the news is streamed without bias, unless it’s an Editorial.
Acro
The only other stories on domaining.com about the conference all chatted about the auction, not the overall conference.
I think the auction was streamed on domaining.com so it could be viewed by people not in attendance.
Andrew from domainnamewire.com had some additional thoughts about the conference but at least he was there.
I believe that readers of Owen’s post are intelligent enough to process his thoughts and decide what to retain and what to reject. I agree that the words “TRAFFIC sucked” were harsh, however that’s his own opinion.
“Although I did not attend this time, I found Frager’s statements to be noteworthy as they echoed the opinions of others that summarized the results of TRAFFIC.”
Theo – WHO are these unnamed “Others” you refer to? I WAS there and I did not talk to a single person who “echoed those opinions.” In fact the opinion I heard from people who WERE there was 180 degrees from those the writer expressed (again, aside from the auction, the results of which were disappointing to everyone including the organizers). The value of this show is meeting key people face to face, doing deals and building relationships. TRAFFIC was a home run in that regard.
I’m not going to comment further on this because I feel used knowing I am playing right into the writer’s hands and giving him the attention he wants regardless of who the ploy hurts (“Calling it like is is” is has nothing to do with what that post was about in my opinion).
Obviously, I am not willing to become a scapegoat here, Mike and Ron, for simply pointing to Frager’s article. If you take offense at his writing, ask him why he’s so upset.
Looks to me like Stuart just got a typed-out-handjob.
Traffic did suck (I wuz there). Domaining IS NOT AN INDUSTRY. Damn, anyone who calls this BS biz an actual INDUSTRY is a FRAGIN FOOL! Sure, you can make yurself a few bux selling domains, but to call this an INDUSTRY? GIMMEE a FRAGIN brake!
This post proves what I had hoped this blog would not turn into…I was wrong.
I never respected frager one bit. Period.
@mhb thankyou in posting this and your views.
I won’t comment on TRAFFIC as the conference, but the auction completely bombed. There is no way to debate that.
– There was 240K in total sales. Nothing major sold.
– Sex.co – $60K top bid. The reserve was not published as far as I know, so if it was $50K it would have sold there for a top 5 keyword.
– Most of the .XXX under-produced despite the hype, high profile private sales, and sponsorship.
– When I looked at the live stream there were 3-4 people there out of about 40 seats in view
– No online bidding was a huge mistake.
– The auctioneer kept messing up domain names.
– There were domains not getting $500 bids between domains with reserves of several hundred thousand
Owen had a pretty good point below –
_______________________________________________________
One last point. I think it was a mistake to co-mingle the .XXX launch with the main event. It should have been an adjunct, the next day for interested participants. I think of domainers as some of the most open minded and forward thinking people in the world. I was shocked to see how much resistance there was to .XXX. Some people still think pornography is wrong for moral and religious reasons. When the hear SheMale sold for whatever, they aren’t thinking how great that is but rather if their kid or spouse wanders into that site will they become a freak. A lot of people were uncomfortable. I was heard from many folks they almost didn’t come and know of others who sat this one out in fear of all the photos that would spread through Facebook that might embarrass them or send an impression to kids or employers that they were attending a porn convention.”
________________________________________________________
I totally agree that could turn off a lot of people. There is a difference between people wanting to attend a domainer conference and a porn convention.
Brad
Yeah, Owen’s statements are ridiculous, it really is like he wasn’t at the same event. There are many companies who are innovating in the domain industry. “Parking Companies” are making big changes to move away from being so reliant on revenue driven by Google and Yahoo. There are many domain investors who are doing quite well developing their names and monetizing them. If he’s so frustrated he should build out ShoeDepartment.com instead of waiting for Zappos to cut him a check for millions for a parked domain. Owen should lead by example instead of sitting on the sidelines blogging so much.
the .xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx abomination will go down as a bigger fail that .coco
Brad
I think the .XXX slogan is particularly relevant here;
let’s be adult about it
I have been to AVN and “porn conventions”
This was no porn convention.
This is a TLD approved by ICANN and is in the root.
There are going to be TV ads for the product, print ads in non-adult publications (already has been) and all sorts of traditional advertising for .XXX
It’s a legal business, you may not like it but they are entitled to advertise and promote like the next guy.
Just returned home.
I thought the conference was great and it was re-energizing. The mood seemed fairly jovial – certainly more so than a couple years back. I learned more about some innovating products and services in the domain space and will be trying at least a couple in the coming days.
Theo, I am a bit confused by your comment: “Mike, the consensus is that TRAFFIC failed to produce the steam it promised.”
If Theo is only talking about the auction, he’s probably right. However, the auction is only a 2 hour, small part of the actual TRAFFIC conference, and most people I spoke with thought the conference was beneficial to their businesses. I certainly did and also had a fun time with colleagues/friends.
The reality is, this blog, which is primarily frequented by barely literate retards and millionaire-wannabe’s that piss their cash away on the next .WASTE, won as the best blog for the domain business. This selection should speak volumes to those who somehow think they are part of a money-making industry.
There’s a sucker born every minute…
@ MHB
“This is a TLD approved by ICANN and is in the root.”
With all due respect, who cares.
Not everyone is comfortable with having porn advertised in mainstream media.
Brad
Most decent human beings agree with what Brad just said. Money ain’t everything.
Sounds like a refreshing account to me. Props to Frager for being willing to take the firestorm and saying it how he saw it.
Well Mike, its no surprise the two most blocked blogs on Domaining.com Frager and DomainGang, says a lot.
Brad, with no disrespect, who cares what you think ? Just like you said to Mike.
You seem to always be around when there is .co or .xxx talk and being negative. I guess you are the Ralph Nader of the wayward alternative domain investors.
Elliot, I will point you to my post above, therefore including you along with Mike and Ron in an attempt to use me as a scapegoat. Owen’s opinion, however harsh his language might be is his own. I pointed to it because I found it to be noteworthy. If you prefer to see the subject differently, you will find plenty of domainers on the other side of the river. Best of luck.
@John – Domaining.com provides only 20% of the DomainGang.com traffic. Eighty “blocks” at Domaing.com mean nothing 🙂 Good luck bashing what you don’t know.
Brad
You comfort level doesn’t dictate what appears in the media.
There is plenty of stuff I wish I wasn’t subjected watching including this years Dancing with the Stars
Bashing ? I stated an irrefutable fact. Next
Frager link baited me by spam when he first started his blog. I made sure I avoided his blog since. That said, I stopped going to Traffic shows years ago. In the early years I would gain something that justified the expense. Now it seems more like a job fair for domain name service business employees.
Apologies, I was wrong with my last post above.
Domaining.com provided only 13.48% of traffic to DomainGang.com for the past 30 days. I could care less if “John” reads it or not.
People have dissenting opinions, Frager’s statements use a strong wording but all you starry-eyed core attendees need to take a step back and watch what Joe Domainer saw.
Thank you and good night.
@ MHB
“You comfort level doesn’t dictate what appears in the media.”
I agree.
It is a free country. .XXX can do what it want as long as it is legal.
If corporate interests are willing to sell out principals for cash, that does not surprise me.
Then again, money is not my only motivation.
At the end of the day extensions like .XXX will just make it easier to fragment the internet. I don’t understand the practical use when .XXX will be simple to block without any content filter.
Brad
Dear @John – 80 users registered and thus blocked DomainGang.com. I get 1,000 uniques a day, do you think 80 means anything? Again, your prerogative to believe what you want to believe. People need to learn to respect the opinions of others.
Who did not respect the opinions of others. Sometimes Acro people formulate opinions over time and realize they have no respect for someone. I have no respect for Owen Frager as a domainer, what has he ever done as a domainer ?
I’m sure sure that if you are one of the domaining elite, any chance you get to get together and party in a penthouse suite is going to be a grand time. But this is supposed to be the flagship conference for the domain industry, and it looks like it’s 1/2 porn convention and 1/2 dying industry. The Auction was painful to watch. It literally looked and sounded like an empty room. Who the hell puts borderline reg fee names in that auction? While the good names did not get to 30% of their reserve. Francois may have to tinker with his valuate.com metrics. A 70% across the board cut would probably be about right. The “traditional” domain market is on the downside of the mountain and going down fast. In a few years a good.com .net or .org is going to be as valuable and interesting as a decent 800 number. Soon people will have so many options, the extension is not going to matter, you can only dilute the market so far until you kill the market itself. Soon the owners of the 95% of domains that are registered but not being used are going to realize that there holdings are for the most part, worthless. If you want your domains to be valuable, you are going to have to make them valuable by building your own business on them. The only place that has any excitement is the new GTLD’s and not everyone can or wants to play in that space. Once those babies hit, you can kiss domaining as we know it goodbye. I am not sure why anyone would invest in building a new parking platform. It will not be long until there is no such thing as an address bar, and if there is, you will probably have to hit F9 or something to bring it up. Traffic may or may not have sucked, but the Auction DID suck, and the direction of the traditional domain business sucks worse. For those who think domains will come back, remember technology always moves forward, it never goes back to the way it was, never.
We have finally run out of greater fools.
Mike,
Your examples of newcomers to the industry are self-made multi-millionaires who made their fortunes elsewhere and took them to domaining. Gone are the days of the new self-made millionaires from within domaining. The industry has evolved and new players are taking part. Maybe F_Factor misses the old days. Domaining isn’t dead, it has simply changed.
@Brad is datacube changing the world ? What is your motivation for selling domains ?
fuck fragger !!
@John – I’ve had issues with Owen Frager in the past but 1) I don’t block any Domaining.com feeds to demonstrate a blog’s worth and 2) I found Owen’s particular post worthy of further analysis.
On the other hand, you seem to think that 83 blocks mean “something” – or 88 in the case of Frager. I can assure you that the popularity of DomainGang.com has nothing to do with Domaining.com – of course, it’s a matter of taste whether you read it or any other online publication for that matter.
Tomorrow, everyone will write their own part of the story – bashing what they want to generate traffic with 🙂 Frager is a smart man and the linkbait is obvious. By keeping an open mind you demonstrate your ability to process content or to simply chew headlines. That’s the difference between intelligence and stupidity.
@ John
“is datacube changing the world ? What is your motivation for selling domains?”
Yes, one domain at a time.
Brad
I’ve never understood why DomainGang is even read at all. I’ve read the blog five times in the last two years. And after an article was posted that made light of a woman being assaulted following the Playboy Mansion party last year, I haven’t gone back to the site since. What’s passed off as satire is just really moronic writing from individuals who can’t contribute anything legitimately worth reading.
And speaking of the PBM party, that single event was far more salacious than the XXX registry’s entire presence at TRAFFIC. You would be more likely to be offended watching cable television then anything you might have seen at this years TRAFFIC. I had my own concerns prior to arriving, but they handled it with class.
The only people who should be making judgements are the ones who were actually there.
I wasn’t looking to get into the fray here but Mike’s comment about never going backward was …well backward. The URL will not be going away anytime soon. It is the place where people empower themselves. Domain names simply give power back to the people. Sorry, I am not about to let any search engine show me were I must go. Search is just a tool, not a way of virtual life.
Remember the rotary for the phone? When it was invented it empowered people to find other people. We really didn’t need operators as much since we could dial a number/IP to find others. We are still using 1 through 9 to make phone calls after how many years? Domain names and IPs are no different.
Mike,
Thanks for confirming what I’ve been trying to communicate to Rick and Howard all day day long that my post was not an attack on or critical of Traffic, it actually praised traffic as you pointed out. The only reason for this perception is a poor headline choice which has been updated to Traffic Didn’t Suck, I Suck. Yes I am conflicted no I don’t hold traffic responsible for the state of the industry or the economy nor did I mean to imply that. Many of your points are well taken. And if John Ferber had a booth, I missed it. I have the highest respect for John and his team and what they are trying to accomplish. In fact John was just featured on my blog as the first of 20 of the most fascinating people in domaining for 2011: http://fragerfactor.blogspot.com/2011/10/john-ferber-domain-success-off-scales.html
John,
I’ve sold over $200K in domains and continue to average one end user sale per year av $25K (this year almost 50K including a .co and name selected for a major financial software product.
I’ve earned over $100K in parking on one domain that cost $70 to buy in 1999 and $10 year to maintain and continue to earn 10K per year in the down economy.
I’ve contributed to hundreds of ideas, information and techniques in private domain forums for over ten years that have been widely embraced by some of the most successful domain era, many of whom I still advise privately.
I started a domain blog with my own two hands, created 8000 pages of content which is visited by over 30K readers per month mostly from Google searching for people like Mike berkens, Frank Schilling, John Ferber and 100 others whom I’ve profiled in a very favorable light. I hold over 10K top four Google search positions on keywords like herman Cain 999, Apple Stock Forecast, iCloud email domain, anne weeny and more. My blog has been visited by reps of every major Fortune 500 corporation, university even the US Senate. These visits are chronicled in a private VIP email that is opened and read by over 100 c-level executives including the leaders of many domain and registry firms some of whom support my blog with advertising or retainer programs that bill over 10K per month. Previously I named products and services for major technology brands. You’ll find the names I created on Xerox machines, postage machines and supported a bell labs patent for mission critical access technology that over 800K corporations worldwide pay their local bell companies $50 a month for since we trademarked the name in 1990. I am also a director of a family trust that owns 2200 shopping centers in the east coast each anchored by a supermarket, drug store (mostly Walgreens) and discount department store (target).
So Joh, what the fuck have YOU done?
@T1D – Your lack of a sense of humor is not of my concern. If I had the option to not be exposed to bullshit I would have skipped your comment as well. The point is, this is not about DomainGang.com, it’s about a post made by Owen Frager. There’s a Greek proverb: if you can’t beat up the donkey, you beat up the saddle. Sorry if I need to analyze that one to you as well; if you had a hard time understanding that Daryl the Drunk Domainer and his Playboy mansion escapades were pure fiction for fun.
Seriously Mike, I hoped for a better level of readership here.
I can tell you one thing, if you don’t read the Frager Factor, you sure are missing on a lot of stuff. The man is relentless in posting both good and junk….
I have learned a lot from checking his shit out daily.
Having said that, TRAFFIC did suck. You don’t have to be there to know.
It’s horrible in IRAQ because there’s war there, and it’s hot in the desert; how do I know that? Did I go there? NO! I just know by watching it on TV and internet.
You can see the divide in this debate: people who think that they are an elite, and gonna form a gang or cabal, to suppress speech and opinion, and make connections among themselves to launch stupid products, and suck blood out of the rest of us, and the people who are idol worshipers, who are willing to bend over and get it from behind from these people all day! Well, I’m here to announce a third group: people who will keep this industry on a straight path, and make it fair for all. No more letting anyone hijack this thing. From next show, it is going to be all information in the open. I’m putting everyone on notice, from MHB to Elliot, it’s time to stop the shenanigans!
Ps. Part of my post was critical of the new extensions if only to stay what about .com- we need help and advocacy promoting aftermarket values to end users. That’s where the bulk of the industry will benefit not just the few who will be enriched by new extensions. Think about it. 16 million listings stuck in a holding pattern on Sedo. What can unstick them. That’s the innovation that myself and those I chatted with at Traffic are in dire need of and I don’t see anyone (except Frank who demo’d his sales solution to me which includes inquiry education on what you need to consider before deciding how much to offer. It’s a game changer! One of Frank’s rapidly expanding tech team closed a $100K sale on a iPad while his associate was showing me how to set up my own links on his laptop- which reminds me that I need to go into 200 sales pages and change the code. See I guess there was innovation. Depression over. Onward.
Covered my shorts on DMD today….
Told ya so.
Oh great, Theo of Domaingang.com pulled his article, and Owen of FragerFactor.com changed his Headline?
So, these are the characters that will bend over and take it from the rear all day!
Because someone barked at you, you change your opinion? Awesome!
IT’S TIME TO PROMOTE EVERYBODY TO TYPEIN DIRECT TO THE ADDRESS BAR. Domainers HAVE THE POWER. DOMAINS WAS THE FIRST SEARCH ENGINE. BYPASS THE SEARCH ENGINES GO DIRECT > 2012
I agree with T1D. The domain gang is one stupid blog. Always made me wonder who reads this ish. Maybe next time go yourself, and formulate your own opinion instead of using someone else’s. Maybe even you and that frager start your own domain auction event. I hate folks that just sit back and criticize what others are trying to do. I love folks that try and do. they are what makes the world go around. Maybe shut that stupid domain gang blog down. I don’t think anyone really reads that foolishness.
Uzoma – The article is there, maybe you need to remove thumb from own ass?
http://domaingang.com/short-news/traffic-2011-the-frager-factor-calls-it-like-it-is/
I begin to think the average blog post commentator gets off on their own wiseguy crap. Uzoma, go get tissues.xxx – it’s not a premium yet.
Uzoma – The article is there, maybe you need to remove thumb from own ass?
I begin to think the average blog post commentator gets off on their own wiseguy crap.
Uzoma, go get tissues.xxx – it’s not a premium yet.
@Melodramatic – Cry me a river. Post what you’ve done and then you can claim authority of any kind.
“So, these are the characters that will bend over and take it from the rear all day!”
If you have the balls to say something, have the balls to defend it.
Brad
@Melodramatic – “Maybe shut that stupid domain gang blog down”
I’m sorry but I think nazism is so 1939. Unless of course your family served in the SS.
@Brad – I agree. So keep 3 feet away because my balls might touch you.
I didn’t change the article. I changed the headline that was misleading because the article wasnt about that. I’m a copywriter by day and that’s what I do create headlines that get attention. In this world on a feed with a million choices, you can get opened or passed. Some call it link bait. I call it skill and you don’t complain about it when you fall victim to other writers every day in the emails you open, ads you respond to or news you read. However, in this case my choice was in very poor judgement because I hadn’t considered the affect it would have on the people who worked hard to deliver Traffic or to the perception of their brand. And for this I extend my sincere apologies to Rick, Howard, Barbara and Alina.
Sorry Owen, but here’s what you removed from yesterday’s post, why don’t you stand by your original words?
___________
“I will end where I began with the headline Traffic SUCKED. One would expect that a key takeaway from a show named TRAFFIC is lots of ideas and strategies how you could get more. Like when Dan Warner showed the stats and what can happen simply by changing a picture, color or optimizing. Rick with the enter button. Or the SEO panel that was eye-opening.
One strategy that’s never been covered at TRAFFIC is copywriting. This headline will generate record traffic as well as inspire a lot of discussion in the forums where the story will be cut and pasted and viewed thousands of times that will not be credited to the blogs stats.
This is but one of thousands of strategies that have never been shared. So from the ashes will rise…. the future we’ve been hoping for. I hope to see you there. “
in years past, domainers writing about domaining repeatedly lamented about trying to make their “industry” into a respectable one. they appeared, and still do, to want to be taken seriously. but their actions seem to suggest otherwise.
porn = PR fail
yes, money will be made. but as someone else eloquently stated, it’s not everything.
domaining requires few if any credentials, and no business reputation. no ivy league diploma is required to be persuasive. no professional qualifications are needed. you do not have to be a computer science major to understand how things work. literally anyone can have an impact if they make the effort. and most of it can be done via a keyboard and monitor. indeed, there’s plenty of opportunity for just about anyone who can operate a computer.
however if one wants to be recognised and respected outside of the domainer world, and it seems this does matter to some people, then things become more complicated. for one, managing reputation is important.
perhaps the wisest domainers have been the ones no one ever sees or hears from.
what would yun ye say to all this? maybe he wouldn’t say anything.
the domainers at a traffic conference do not represent all domainers. but to the outside world, they might. and for some, were they to be associated with it, that might be a real problem.
using icann’s root is not a rule. it is a convention that many follow. but conventions can change. if .xxx being in the icann root is significant in some way, then it’s probably significant in a way that damages icann’s public relations. that said, as long as the conventions stay the same, .xxx will get traffic.
MHB, I’m disappointed as a long time reader. You took the bait and fulfilled Frager’s fantasy to stay relevant. Constantly posting controversial headlines is marketing 101, not rocket science.
We must respect Frager, he made a website about Napa Valley (ExperienceNapa.com), he brags about ranking for “Mike Berkens”, and he can spell Apple, Google, and Schilling.
Ladies and gentlemen, a true visionary!
This is hilarious.. people’s feathers getting ruffled over a stupid blog post. At least it brings out some of the true character of the bloggers who hide behind their blog posts. I think what Uzoma had to say is very relevant… the industry seems to be divided into two camps, those who say kiss my ass and those who take it up the ass.
Dean – Exactly. Those that take it up the ass have no link to provide and are full of anonymous criticism. Maybe because nazism is alive still?
Let’s all be adult about this. Owen gave his perspective and on a lot of points he was correct. Look, a lot of can’t attend these shows so we see what we see and that was a mixed bag of domains of which some should never have been there. Names such as CamQuarter.com? What is that? It means nothing.
So mistakes were made. However, it is a sad day when someone gives their opinion on an event and everybody says he is wrong. I see a lot of clickish behavior in this industry. You alienate domainers and as far as I can see, never reach out to people who don’t attend these shows. So although you disagree with Owen, I thought his article was refreshing and I was glad to see him stating what so many of us also thought.
Finally, good or bad, don’t attack the guy. If he had given a glowing review, you would all be falling all over yourselves to thank him. After 15-years in this industry, I have never seen so many people trying to save an industry that is weak right now. So is everything else! We are in deep crap with this economy and the auction reflected that more than anything.
@Bruce – Finally, someone who ‘gets it’. That’s what it’s all about.
People don’t care about what others have to say, mobs thrive in that mentality. If one is different, the mob brings on the pitchforks. If one is dissenting, he must be wrong!
Well folks, time to open your eyes a little bit. Life is short, art is long.
@ Bruce
“However, it is a sad day when someone gives their opinion on an event and everybody says he is wrong. I see a lot of clickish behavior in this industry. ”
I agree.
Brad
Acro,
seriously, I don’t get the “humor” in Domain Gang. Most often It borders on the moronic and unintelligible. It’s your life, but I think your time would be better spent SEO’ing something than wasting your time on that crap. As for Frager’s post, right or wrong, I think he is entitled to his opinion, just like every other “authority” and blogger in the hemisphere (blogosphere.) I agree he’s a link/numbers whore, and I often wrote him off as just that, but he also posts some very fascinating and cutting edge stuff that strays from the gamut of predictable domain this, domain that… push this affiliate… that extension, parking company mentality, been posted a million times before stuff. It’s like anything else in life, you have to separate the wheat from the chaff and find those little nuggets or kernels of truth or relevancy that you can apply or use.
I just finished reading every comment posted on this thread and have come to the conclusion that each one of us needs to get back to work and preserve this industry. If we continue to take sides and debate one another nothing gets done. I don’t care who your friends are or what you have accomplished. I care that you are going to work just as hard as the next domain investor to instill some quality and control within this ever growing sector.
Yes in with the new and out with the old. It’s no longer the gold mining era. Techniques have changed and technology has evolved. Those that reap the rewards stay ahead of the game. You can call them “domaining elite” I see them as smart business men. Enough of the jealousy, enough with the egos. Lets get back to what we are good at and that is working to generate healthy lines of income for ourselves while contributing positively to this industry. In the end, this industry will only survive if we help others recognize the potential within it.
Ive never been more optimistic about the business, I see a lot of opportunity, especially in the development and optimization of domain properties. If you can put it all together, dev, desing, traffic, conversion and put a concept behind it, you can surely push a domain value higher and it is much easier to move income generating properties as opposed to undeveloped domains.
The best blog is still DomainGang and the rest is just still “BullS”
I did not go but I would think that if you have 300 people in the same room with the same interests, your going to come away with more knowledge than you had before. Good or bad it does not matter. You probably learned something new.
As far as auction results go, that is not indicator of how well the event went. Probably best not to even have an auction. To many people get the auction results mixed up with how well an event went. I hope they have it in Vegas with no auction at all next time.
Domain names are not dead wait until first week of November.
Don
The bitches in this industry and you know who you are.
Can’t wait to read Owen banned from traffic conferences.
I believe this is the first day Frager didn’t blog about Frank Schilling.
He’s probably writing up one for tomorrow as I speak.
I think Mr. F is Not Well !
The domaining industry will only get stronger and stronger always simply becasue of the fact that businesses that want to succeed and prosper must have two basics; clear vision and a road map. The fundamental core of these two basics is a DOMAIN NAME.
The domain name is the IDENTITY that differenciates businesses and give them their own foot and finger prints. The domain name is the BASE that every business is built on. The domain name is the DOOR that welcomes customers and guides them to what they look for. The domain name is the SEED that results from an idea and grows everyday stronger and stronger. The domain name is so precious it lives in hearts and minds of both the business and the customer.
Ben Elza
Dean – Without a link to your own work, you’re simply another apparent jealous commentator without much creativity to display. Thankfully, as far as I’m concerned you’re part of the pathetic minority.
It’s people like you that don’t “get it” that provide me with an endless amount of content for those that do “get it”. In fact, this very thread will generate at least two days worth of DomainGang posts. Stay tuned.
And even if “this thread” generates at least two days worth of post about that stupid blog, folks still won’t visit that stupid blog. It makes no sense. By the way, I like the title of your new post, it’s attention grabbing….maybe it will get you some visits. Thank me later for the topic.
@Melodramatic – I’m sorry to hear that you’re genetically stripped of the humor gene. I can assure you, that folks do and will continue to visit DomainGang, even if you – an anonymous trolling retard – say that they won’t. The difference between lemmings and readers lies in people’s choice. If you want to be taken seriously, provide your own achievements instead of riding on a post’s comments like a redneck on a pony.
This auction was not successful and attacking Owen is really discussing.
Now I see clearly that in this industry there are many ass bloger lickers.
Probably the biggest one is Elliotsblog.
You do not have to be everywhere to look at facts and make correct calculation.
I am going to read more Owen`s blog from now as he seems to me very honest guy (does not lick asses `big domainers`) which I do not see many here.
Apart from that Owen has right to his own opinion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The only one visiting your blog is…you. I have had more laughs at you on this thread, than that of that stupid domain gang blog.
@Melodramatic – Seriously? I’m the only one visiting DomainGang.com ? Can you prove it? Because I can prove the opposite, but you’ll have to prove that you have some testicles first by posting eponymously.
The only reason I’m responding to your crap here is to show Mike how important it is to filter comments based on quality. If you want to show off your virtual penis size do so by providing stats of your own. Until then you’re a digital fart on my screen.
DomainGang.com
Traffic Rank in US: 16,372
It is one of the more popular domain blogs.
I enjoy the parody, at least it is something unique.
Brad
One problem is that the auction is often the most “visible” face of any domain conference, whether it’s a core part of proceedings or not. You only have to check the front page of the blog aggregators such as Domaining.com to see how much attention was being paid to the auction – not the wider conference, the auction – whereas pieces on the “meat and potatoes” of the various sessions i.e. all the great stuff shared by the panelists and emerging in conversation are much harder to come by.
Perhaps that’s because (fairly) people don’t want to dilute the many thousands of dollars they invested in attending (ticket+hotel+travel for most folks is going to >$5,000 for the full show I’d guess) by spilling the beans on what was said and learned. But the flip-side of that tight-lippedness is that the only picture that the “outside world” gets to see (apart from the occasional blog comment and Ron’s great roundups) is the auction and its aftermath.
So couple a seemingly sparsely populated room (no more than a dozen people in shot during the whole 3+ hour auction) when viewed remotely with the results from the auction, and it’s no real surprise that perceptions are coloured negatively.
This could easily be countered, for instance, if bloggers were to step forward and peel back the curtain (not draw it away, for sure, but flip up a corner) so that those not in attendance at the show could get a better “taste” of the whole (by all accounts excellent) experience, rather than looking at one small rather unfortunate piece of it.
For those that are interested in FACTS……
As fate would have it, not having online bidding SAVED the auction regardless of the outcome.
Ask the folks there how bad the wi-fi was. But it was not the Hotel Wi-Fi.
There was a major ATT outage because of the storm in the area. It was not the fault of the Ritz and I have independent proof emailed to me shortly before the auction..
“Dear Residents –
AT&T continues to have issues, and our landline phone service is again not working.
This is not an LOBC specific problem.
We have registered both service calls and complaints with AT&T.
You will receive an email update once service is restored.”
That email was from the property I own just 2 buildings away from the Ritz. I think with 30++MPH winds and a few inches of rain caused the problem
Soooooo…..had we had online bidding we would have been shut down and the chorus of what you hear now would be 10X worse. We would have also followed the same disaster that faced the last 2 big auctions.
So hindsight always being 20/20 shows we called it right regardless of all the reasons on both sides to have or not to have the auction online. This was our first auction and we decided 2 things. We decided we had to bring back the credibility and we decided not to deal with a potential problem.
As far as TRAFFIC itself, everyone I spoke to said it was the BEST EVER! So much so that there is a call to go to Las Vegas from the people that actually attended. Not something I want to do. One show is enough for me. But we are driven by demand and so we will explore. But I really would rather have one because you folks that talk out of your ass have no idea the hours we put in and the devotion we have. No idea at all. Even the jackasses here benefit from TRAFFIC.
I think even a few folks that are not known as big fans of mine enjoyed their time and what they got out of the show.
Let me tell you what the #1 topic was:
Life is too short to deal with naysayers and non-productive people. So is there a split in the industry coming?? You bet your ass. It already started and some of you are not going to like it. But you brought it on yourselves as the “Haters” as Adam Dicker puts it.
Steve Jobs was a contemporary who had everything in the world and he is dead. We will all be dead and the sand runs through the glass faster than most of us like. So folks that don’t understand how short life is and precious it is are out of touch and the folks I know, want nothing to do with them. Nothing.
Owen’s post is a sideshow. It just opened the cages for the haters and jerks. PERIOD! Some of you fell into HIS trap and that will hurt your futures in this industry.
“DomainGang.com
Traffic Rank in US: 16,372”
“DomainGang.com. I get 1,000 uniques a day,”
And look at the #1 topic……Rick Schwartz or T.R.A.F.F.I.C. appears in so many posts. I can count them all. Can you?
1000 visitors a day with up to 9 posts a DAY is nothing to brag about. Come on. You have more posts in 6 months than I have made in total since 2007 in total. Some of it is very funny, some is drivel. Some serious some not and sometimes you can’t tell the difference. The “100%” thing is a marketing mistake. Should be on the top BEFORE you read the article, not after when it has little or no value.
http://www.domaining.com/feed/domaingang/
I think it was one of the best Traffic shows so far, many new faces, lots of business, it was worth every dollar.
@Bruce : What are you talking about ? You have never been at any Traffic show and with your way to do business I dont believe its even an option for you.
I’ve never been to any of these conferences and I dont know anyone of these people. Its always interesting to read what people write about this industry. I have my own opinions from my experiences in this domaining world. For now I will keep them to myself. However, I death knocked at my door 3 times in the past year, and one time I actually opened the door and saw it face to face. I dont hold the sentiment that because I almost died, 3 times in 12 months now, that I need to be bright, cheery and happy about everything. In fact, I am more vocal the other way now. I used to not complain about things that bothered me and now I speak up BECAUSE……… time IS short. Why sit on the sidelines. Steve Jobs didnt sit around and say nothing OR, better, only good things about everyone and everything he came into contact with.
Whatever may be, people are entitled to their opinions. If someone didnt like the event, they’re 100% within their right to express that they didnt and to defend that position. Of course, anyone else is entitled to their own opinion as well – whether or not it agrees with the other person. Its not as if he posted one sentence of how much it sucked, without any explanation and reasoning and left it at that. Thats a troll.
So if he hated the event, so what. I respect people for being brutally honest, whether or not they’re correct is up for debate but people need to be able to say what they’re thinking. We’re losing this today in this politically correct, no one loses, everything is always peachy and rosy world of “Bright Sided Thinking” and “Positive Psychology” where people can make a nuclear blast into a sunny day at the beach.
If the guy hated it, so be it. Let him hate it. It doesnt make people a “hater”. There is no need to categorize people like that. Because I dont care for dating certain races of women doesnt make me a “racist”. Because I say a certain sex is better at something than another doesnt make me a “sexist”. All fo these terms are so diluted because they’re overused and well abused. Let him hate the event and the best medicine for people like that is to ignore them. The attention is what they want and so, kudos for a job well done!
Long time lurker here enjoying life and traveling the world, its an intersting thread. First, the industry is ever evolving. What worked five yrs ago doesnt work today. “adapt or die”. Traffic is still a highky relevant conferernce but you have to know what to look for. Money now obviously isnt in parking, its in new gtlds. Its an opportunit very few recognize and even less of the oldtimerx will shift and capitalize while others cry a river. Smart now either adapts or relaxesand waiting for the next opportunity. Dumb is one who chs old ideas beliveing nothing has changed.
I took a vacation from TRAFFIC for a few years (other commitments, blahblah) and came back to this one.
T’was a fabulous event, well worth every dime. I was the #5 advance registrant for this one, I’m gonna try to be #1 for next year. 🙂
Please note how high in this thread Owen’s apology (and corrective action) is. Actions speak louder than words to me. Net net? A great show, a great rant by Michael and a great response from Owen. It’s still the “old days” in that sense — there are folks in this community who watch out for, and take care of, each other.
And there are those who don’t.
@ Rick Schwartz “this was our first auction”
Priceless.
Maybe Mr Frager & Mr. Cohen should start a copyrighting service with their skillful headline creations…they could call it “Wanna Copyright” 😀
Bruce, hah what a joke this guy. Bruce Tedeschi is a wantrepreneur and grade A hillbilly ignoramus with an IQ of 0. His Facebook rants are idiotic and he said that the occupy protesters need a style coach when he looks like he just rolled out of bed himself.
Take this guys comments with a grain of salt as I think he has a 9th grade edu and has NO business acumen or brains for that matter. Friend him on FB and see/laugh for yourself. Better yet, zillow his whois address on techdomainer.com to check out his sweet 50k diggs. Wantrepreuner.
On a sidenote, if you haven’t noticed the trend of domain name firesales and closeouts and half price specials I think you see the writing on the wall. If you dont have a mike mann style portfolio then your reg fees to your cobweb filled portfolio of junk is going to be your early grave as most domainers are so stubborn with their collection of non developed junk they don’t see the writing on the wall.
I agree on the Domain Gang. I wish there was a way to block their blog on Domaining like you can on NameBee. I think they lack any sense of humor and find their posts to be pointless and borderline mean at times.
@Acro/DomainGang
I don’t think you really understand the ideology and practice of National Socialism – comparing it to a comment troll is tasteless and inappropriate to say the least.
And the Voltaire quote goes both ways! So I guess you’ll be waiting for him, armed, to protect his trollish right to THINK (and say so) that your stupid blog sucks and voice his OPINION that it should be shut down.
Don’t Dish it Out if You can’t Take It!
Excuse me, this was the first auction we controlled. The first one we put on the entire production.
In the past we had used either Moniker or Latona or a host of others. So we did things that had never been done. It’s not our primary business so we are not dependent on the income. That allows us to be more transparent and we have to build the trust that have been lost because of scandals and fake bidding by anon’s and the likes of Halvarez.
Even if the results were disappointing the auction was not boring. There was plenty of activity and only 3 or 4 domains received no bids at all.
I know in the next auction I will put the “Guaranteed Placements” (About 30 domains in this auction) later in the auction especially if they are priced over what I believe is obtainable.
Some of the domains we got just days before the auction. Definitely not enough time to promote and do them justice. But they were great domains and they were and ARE up for grabs and the only thing now is figuring out a price point.
Many domainers are upside down like the rest of the world. Money is tight. It will likely remain that way until the elections next year. Does not mean Cheese.com for $1MM was not a great domain that a business can be built around. Maybe $750,000 gets the deal done. Then again maybe if Property.com was in the auction nobody would pony up the $750,000 that I did. Does not make it a less valuable domain just because all other domainers that were presented it to passed on it??
One thing is for sure, and you can ask anybody IN THE ROOM. There was NO fake bidding. There was no showboating and there was no bullshit. It was a clean auction and that is the way it will remain. We may or may not have Internet bidding for the next show. If we can’t guarantee that it goes flawlessly, we will use phones again.
Confidence takes time especially when you need to clean up past abuses. I think you will see folks submitting higher quality domains at more reasonable reserves as the market gets tighter and domainers need $$$. We will still be a bona fide outlet with a qualified audience. They just said the prices were too high.
Last note. When we introduced the auction in 2004 and the live one in 2005, the motive was to just have some fun at the show and mix it up. We had no idea it would evolve how it has with dozens of folks doing them as a business. That Moniker would be launched into the stratosphere with that part of it. It was just something that Howard, Monte and I thought would add something to the conference.
But this was the first auction that Howard and I put on and controlled every aspect. We had no prearranged sales to folks less than an arm lengths distance to save face. There are still 2 deals pending and we will see what happens.
The MARKET spoke. Now domainers can adjust. Domainers are wholesalers not retailers. Prices have to be geared to the wholesale sector unless you can bring 2 or more end users.
Im surprised you all were able to overlook the work of my people, http://DomainMarket.com/ and http://MikeMann.com/
We are hiring tons of people, doing massive investment, growing and innovating more than any group you can find.
Mike
Good to hear
I know there is a lot of new activity in the space and wanted a few examples to use to show this is certainly not “an industry defeated.”
@Rick Schwartz – I don’t appreciate the change in focus here.
The fact is that Owen Frager wrote a post review using the words, “TRAFFIC Sucked”. I didn’t. I simply pointed to his writings, and readers with 1/2 a brain can make their own assumptions.
If you or anyone else attempts to seize the opportunity of this post/thread and plan to use DomainGang as a scapegoat, I will tell you this: it didn’t work for 2 years and it won’t work now.
In fact, you should appreciate the fact that DomainGang exists because that “fake news blog” as you called it in the past has put forth a lot of ideas that keep those that generate the “real news” alive. Navigate to the “Testimonials” page, they are all real.
Why are you wondering about your increased visibility during TRAFFIC in the form of DomainGang articles? You make the news – real or parody – by your daily interaction in the world of domaining. Whether you like it or not, you are a public figure, most like you, some don’t. But then again out of 1,300+ articles at DomainGang the focus isn’t on “Rick Schwartz”, it’s like saying that US politics is all about Obama.
As I don’t advise you on how to run your business/blog and whether you should change that hideous green/lime theme, I’m respectfully not going to take your advice or anyone else’s on where to put the “100%” image. Marketing mistake? It’s not, but even if it were, it’d be *my* mistake. However, numbers have shown that it isn’t.
But again, focus has changed.
The fact remains that I didn’t write Owen Frager’s non-stellar review of TRAFFIC, Rick. Owen did.
So stop hitting on the messenger. Owen Frager is someone you’ve personally known for a while, so why not discuss his opinions with him? I know I would.
I think the biggest thing that you can see is PPC is going to consolidate.
Frank disrupted the entire industry. DomainSponsor used to have in excess of 2.1 million domain when I started keeping track and that was well after the launch of Frank’s program. Last time I looked at was at 1.4 million and change. When you lose 33% of your business, THAT is a problem. When you lose the 33% of your business that was actually 80% of your top domains, survival is not going to come easy. When the biggest tree falls, the rest are in their shadow.
When you have John Ferber, Michael Gilmour, Michael Mann, Scott Richter (and others I apologizing for not mentioning) all doing things to maximize the value of your domains you see new trees coming.
So you are witnessing a slow motion earthquake that will take until the end of next year to fully play out.
Second rick, not first. The first was in 2004 with a chalkboard 🙂
Internet = Rapid Change
IMHO it is the most rapidly changing industry ever. And as more players enter the scene, with more money than ever seen in the Internet space, there will be more change. It’s business. We can all elevate each other and still compete in business.
TRAFFIC was different this year. It has to be. I give Rick and Howard credit for having the vision and moxie to do it.
As the Byrd’s say “A time for peace, I swear it’s not too late “
“@Rick Schwartz – I don’t appreciate the change in focus here.”
Hey Pal, would you like to see MY LIST of things I don’t appreciate.?? So you are crying a river to the wrong guy.
About time your ass got put in the ring. You TOO are a public figure so don’t think you can’t get a little dirty after years of mud slinging? You sit and make fun of who you decide to make fun of and I never made an issue. But to get on your high horse??
Your turn! Now you know how it feels to be me. Enjoy the day.
“Second rick, not first. The first was in 2004 with a chalkboard ”
True, but that was not a LIVE auction. That happened in 2005 and run my Moniker. 🙂
Dont shoot the messenger.
Normally I don’t comment dramatic posts such as this, I leave that to the trolls. I’m not one with authority in this space and God knows I’m NOT perfect. I’m still learning and growing. So my comment should be taken with a grain of salt. It’s not to be taken as vindictive or in defense of anything or anyone. The comment is to point out what I got of Owen’s post.
Whether the article was done with purpose or subconsciously, I enjoyed reading his post and feel it’s one of his better write ups, even if it had some bait in it, but that’s what marketers do, kudos. This post spoke to me as a reflection of the ‘signs of the times’, perhaps the lack of: attendance, the free flowing ideas and maybe the not so great auction sales (the jury is still out). All of this in a overall general meaning, I did not see it as an attack on TRAFFIC event. Yes, there was some constructive criticism on how the event might or should have played out. It should be taken into account, but not dwell on it.
Personally, I wanted to go to this event badly, but because of the reasons mentioned in the article, I struggled with the decision and chose not to. I can relate to it, on the other side of the coin, those who attended will relate to Mike’s post. So just take Owen’s post for what it’s worth and nothing more. And for those who don’t like this comment, (f)orget yo(u)!
Anyway.. just sayin.. peace 🙂
Rick. Kudos for you for knowing how to sheer the sheep. Your partner is blaming YOUR CUSTOMERS for failing to bring buyers to the auction. SO people should PAY YOU to attend the show, PAY YOU to list their domain names in the auction and then PAY YOU a commission when the name sells. You are brilliant sir, at least when compared to the morons who have given you direct access to their pocketbooks.
Since I am obviously not nearly as sharp as either you of Howard can you please explain to me why I might need your auction services if I were in a position to bring my own buyer.
Spin it anyway you want to Rick but the auction was a major flop. I thought you said on your blog that if it flopped YOU would take responsibility yet here we are a day later and Howard is already blaming the people who paid their hard earned money to YOU!
Just goes to prove that the only time you ever bullshit is when your lips are moving
The post was about me. Keep focus on the topic. And keep beating me up for a mistake that has already become the most expensive I have made. Someone mentioned they had cancer, another suggested that I was not well, a third belittled a guy who had to sit Traffic out this time because he is at death’s door. No one knows what external forces there are driving people’s lives and saying mean spirited things about people you don’t even know is nothing more then bullying which we see so many campaigns against, The was wrong to make tat headline, I apologized and I’m glad Mickey O’Connor chimed in for he was a witness to many an occasion where he could testify I was having a great time, some of it with him. The pictures and comments on Facebook all rave about the show (and Geez Steve, if you invited me to THAT suite, to THAT party, the post would have never been written because I’d have gone home drunk and passed out). I never meant to blame the show for the sorry state of one’s ability to liquid domains to end users after 12 years of trying. They still have no clue what they care and why they need them. And if the Earthquake is coming, please God let that solution be apart of it.
Anyone who has seen my posts over the years knows that Rick Schwartz is a man I admire and Traffic is an event I’ve always been bullish on and remain bullish on. It’s not about ass kissing- because he wasn’t the topic I wrote about, he just got sucked in y a poor headline choice that put my self-interest over the feelings of others. Can we move on now.
They have heard the message. Time to move on! My only beef is auctioning off xxx names than only the founders and people with large dollars could buy in the sunrise period had access. I am against any creator of an extension sandbagging names. Put it out there at FCFS or don’\t do it. Allow some new leaders to emerge. Even the wisest of our elders can learn something.
I remember just over a year ago when I said to myself… Self, what the %^&%$ have you done spending all that money at godaddy on your “Idealistic Transformational concepts. You’ve got to be crazy”… I was nine months out with a “Vision” and no understanding of how to make that vision a reality in the technical world of the Internet with what I consider A LOT of “non-defendable” money invested.
A DnCruise and what would have been a second had I not been attacked by a spider just before takeoff, DomainFest in February and now my SECOND TRAFFIC shinned light on the path for this one lost girl in the maze of the Internet black box. I WOULD STILL BE IN THE DARK had I not found you guys out of entrepreneurial necessity. No prior nothing!!!
Having said that, Being in room with the greatest “Information Power Brokers” on the planet was and is amazing….. And that’s not a Kiss A statement because I don’t do that well. It’s a fact! And Owen was one of the highlights of my investment in Traffic this year: An honest professional reality check as were the rest of you I connected with this time. It wasn’t about selling, It was about the financial realities of this business. It made ever dollar well worth the investment. I Thank You and I thank Traffic and it really doesn’t matter what color our glasses are…. What matters is can WE SEE. Without TRAFFIC I would not have met any of you and since we are talking about OWEN, I would not have met Owen who was huge for me…. TRAFFIC is a venue for Economic Free Growth and can handle the Good, the Bad and the UGLY… and non-experienced! lol
We all understand “Knowledge is Power” and you folks based in the ‘organic traffic financial model’ are experiencing the real economic s of that POWER with the Google GANG and are evolving accordingly. I came to the business expecting to build out and then found this amazing simple capitalization of that generic Organic Traffic. Wow! I get it.. I also get that without HEALTHY competition in the marketplace, we are all screwed.. As one who appreciates Transformational Agents, I am on pins and needles to see who and what is going to be the next Model T beyond the Google Gang. God bless them, they brought us A LOT..but freedom resides in Private Property Rights to include the individual intellectual property and the protection of that, free speech and healthy responsible competition. If we allow the continual scraping of those (minds)oops- rights, without innovation in the marketplace, we are all up the creek…
My next investments will be the blogger, lead generation, seo and techology venues. Will look forward to meeting you!
as the .XXX folks say, “Let’s be adult about it”…
More importantly, Let’s keep what made us great! FREEDOM and the responsibility it requires.
Thank you Owen and thank you TRAFFIC..
PJ Ploss….
ps. Excuse typos- People tell me know one in the Industry can understand where I get my spelling- it comes from this little scrooge and the side effects on my mind of the medicine that helps it:
Clients, family and those on a need to know basis know. So now everyone knows. http://is.gd/RaSEq9
I saw an industry adjusting to our economic reality. That is not bad, that is just what happens when we are in a bad world economy. It affects everything. Yes there were things we all would have done differently.
However, it was Rick’s nickel and when he pays for the facility etc. I guess he can do what he wants. I hope that some ideas from everyone are taken to heart by the organizers. It is know one persons fault, it is the state of our economy. We live in an era where every purchase is rethought 2-3 times. People miss the fact that after the auction, these names are renegotiated and sold but not reported all of the time.
I agree with Owen, let it rest…
@Rick Schwartz – But again, the article in question was not written by DomainGang. 🙂
It’s written by Owen Frager.
It could have been written by TechCrunch and you’d be viewing this “controversy” with a different perspective.
Sorry Rick, but I’m not sure you understand exactly what DomainGang does and that’s fine. Just don’t be upset with me; focus on Owen Frager’s writings.
“Mud slinging”?
Surely you can’t be confusing parody (call it “fake” if you prefer) with real news or opinions? DomainGang is a publication, it’s not TMZ to report on gossip or have ulterior motives.
Having attended TRAFFIC in 2008 and 2010 I maintain that they were both successful. It’s unfortunate that Owen Frager’s article wasn’t read between the lines; cared to ask the guy why he’s not happy with the results?
As Mike Stated:
“which was quickly endorsed by DomainGang.com, in its post entitled “Frager Factor calls it like it is” even though the author was NOT in attendance at TRAFFIC (confirmed with DomainGang.com).”
That’s where you go south. How do you KNOW he “Calls it like it is”?? Why not say Calls it the way he sees it” So the difference between you and the imaginary TC article is you endorsed his opinion without even being there which was the point Mike made and you can’t seem to get your head around.
I do understand parody or you would point to something I have said over the years about it. But I have never made a comment about it until today. Not EVER! The good, the bad, the ugly and even sometimes the mean. Not a word.
You expect everyone to have thick skin but yourself? Everyone accountable but yourself?
Was I happy about Owen’s headline? No. It was like we all got punched in the stomach after giving it everything we had and we knew some folks would use it against us as you can plainly see. You being one of them by endorsing something you knew nothing about as shown.
And like I said, your 100% icon does not work on the bottom of the page. Move it up so you don’t waste peoples time or better yet, either make it 100% news or 100% parody because right now, it is 100% confusing for many more than you might think.
May I suggest a forum to discuss a SWAT analysis so all of work as a community to help any future events or efforts BY ANYONE? I give props for having the event and showing that people are still united behind an industry.
No show is perfect and god knows, either am I. However, feedback is always the way to listen the public and understand their concerns. I do not know Rick or Howard but I do know they have their heart and soul in this industry and they have a passion for it. There sales have helped all of in terms of the public even knowing what a domain name is and why it is important to own one.
Points well taken, Rick. I appreciate breaking it down like this.
So I hope all is well between you and Frager now? I mean, the headline was pretty heavy. I would never make that statement unless I attended TRAFFIC myself. But did you not listen to the voices of others that chimed with Frager on the core of his writings?
Again, I understand if you’re not pleased by the role of DomainGang in the industry. But you’re beating up the messenger. I did not endorse anything, I simply pointed to his write-up, which I still find stimulating. A shame he deleted 4 paragraphs at the end.
Rick
When you operate from a position of arrogance and dismiss everyone as a hater, moron, clown, wannabe and disregard any and all criticizm as coming from a place of jealousy THIS is what you get. You are apparently unable or unwilling to hear, see or act on anything that anyone puts forward as constructive instead choosing to label them as clowns. The auction was your doing. Yes you picked some great names. They sold for $200! Whoopdi fucking do!
Man up and take some responsibility for your failures or move over and let someone who knows how to listen and take advice take charge of the domain auction side of things. If you consider this your first auction (your probably alone on this thought too) PLEASE PLEASE let it be your last. Bring back Monte, bring back Latona, or bring in the guys from domainfest who really know how to do things properly. Anyways I know you will cast this off as coming from a hater and fwiw I do hate how you have chosen to handle this. You are going to be the guys to bring credibility to the auction? I don’t think so, and judging from the comments here and elsewhere I am not alone.
Seriously Rick, think it over, even your lapdog Owen has turned into a biter. Time for you to either rethink you rposition of being a know it all who is unable to listen or for you to go back to selling vacuums or encyclopedias of whatever it was you were doing before you went bankrupt and then reinvented yourself with the help of a bunch of porn names.
If you don’t put a name of on your OWN words….besides being SPINELESS to the point of not even owning what you say HIDING behind a keyboard then it is you that is a hater, moron, clown, wannabe by definition. And if you can’t put your name while hiding behind your keyboard you certainly can face me as a person with any credibility. You are a ghost. The exact people that I will try and do everything I can to EXCLUDE from the club of professional domainers. The TRAFFIC App is a way to keep guys like YOU out and folks with names and credibility IN.
So wave bye bye, this train is leaving the station. 🙂
My highlight – I got my pictures and video with Ron Jeremy which I will put in my office !!!
He is a first class representative of an idustry that continually raises eyebrows.
There is a dotted line to his adult industry and our industry of domain investing – someone is always trying to devalue us, kick us in the teeth and step on us. – that new picture in my office respresents a hell of a lot more than a 10 inch !!! – in fact it has nothing to do with it !!!
Rick, Howard and their families put on a first class product every year – and each year I walk out that door – realizing that even though I may not be “hung” – at least hung over with a lot of new motivating ideas.
>>The exact people that I will try and do everything I can to EXCLUDE from the club of professional domainers.
Back to banning people that hurt your feelings? 🙂
>>So wave bye bye, this train is leaving the station. 🙂
It is better to miss the Rickster train.
I do not hate. Takes too much energy. I love you as Owen loves you. It was not you that sucked, it was not the auction that sucked it was not even Owen that sucked. It was the guys who put their names in the auction that sucked. They did not keep their promise to you and Howard to go out and source the end users. God damn those pompous jerks huh. They got what they deserved right! Anxious to hear your plans for next year. Might I suggest that you have everyone go out and catch their own shrimp to eat @ dinner!
This was my first TRAFFIC conference. I thought it was great, informative and fun.
Domaining will have its mood swings but is the best investment on earth just about! Mr. Schwartz & Mr Neu are pioneers and leaders in the industry! We need to always remember this and try to raise the bar on our domaining commitment instead of crying like little babies! Thanks Mr. Schwartz & Mr Neu for being awesome examples for everyone! Blessings! In Jesus!
Ahh now that this is over can we just get back to the Steve Jobs posts over at DomainGang? I respect you for all your hard work Acro but the humor is over at my site. I’m now paying writers with Epik dollars if you want to come join me.
Sorry Shane, not my problem if you lack a humor gene. And riding on Mike’s post to promote your blog, now that’s classy indeed. I’m a gladiator and it shows, I don’t need to outsource my writing.
As the Domains Turn!
Somebody needs to register that name, it sure beats As the World Turns.
On a serious note, to Joe Saladino, I personally don’t need more information, or more fun; I need progress in the domain industry: anything that will bring it closer to the main stream is my concern. I give great kudos to Rick and the organizers at Traffic, but I also mute it with a “mixed-bag” praise. These times is an opportunity to launch the industry to main street. Rick’s name comes often because he is the default leader. He is also the king, and I’ve often called him bigger: a prophet. However, I’m also looking at results: are we better off than we were 4 years ago?
The next conference should put greater emphasis on the numbers, not FUN, or CONNECTIONS, or what have you. If the glass is half, someone can say it’s half empty, and the others can say it is half full, and they’ll be both right. It’s folly to pick on either observer.
You need to outsource it, because what your writing is stupid. You keep hollering your the messenger. Frager didn’t ask you to message anything. He made his own post. What the hell does he need you to message something for him for. ” Don’t make me out to be a scapegoat”…you made yourself that idoit. It seems as though all of your headlines includes either Rick’s name or Frank’s name. Is that how your blog stays afloat? Are you riding off of them? Domain gang is just stupid..stupid..stupid. You keep telling folks that they don’t have a humor gene..your crap is just not humorous. Take that crap DOWN!
@melodramatic – Play the violin behind the anonymous curtain and you’re nothing but a whiner critic, a bad one at that.
I respect Mike not to resort to the namecalling that your kind deserves. You got your 15 seconds of fame, now eff off.
BTW, an incestuous industry with biased leadership doesnt expand our reach. What does one have to do to enter the Domainer Hall of Fame or Domainer of the Year, other than kiss some ass? I invented the expression “premium domains” “domain secondary market” “domain speculation” and “domain investing” (formerly called “registration” and “cybersquatting” respectively.) I have the record for the highest sale, sex.com. I have sold more premium domains than anybody over time. And I have built fantastic domain centric companies and hired many great people and contractors over the years. And its all intended for charitable benefit the whole time, leveraging charity domains too.
http://MikeMann.com/
Gentlemen & Boys,
Here is a little perspective from both sides of the fence, as I have feedback that supports both arguments but at the end of the day, it is just an opinion and not definitive as some have mentioned. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but I believe if you are going to voice it publicly you should support it regardless of what that opinion is.
For one, the face time alone was worth the price of admission. I think everyone should know, this is not a game for boys as the price of poker at this level is expensive and just maybe those that are providing the most criticism may be the ones that are playing at a level they should not be, at least as of yet. Let’s take a quick step back, this is business, some will win and some will lose. As far as determining whether you will win or lose is just like any other conscious business decision at least come up with an ROI or value calculation, you cannot just show up and say “hey, I paid my $1,500+ and Rick promised me a 10x return, where is my check for $15,000?” As that is almost what I am hearing when reading between the lines.
For our organization it was a no-brainer to be there, did I bring my staff of 16? No, I showed up and forked over the couple of grand because I knew regardless of the direct financial benefit I obtained which was far greater than a 10x return, there is value in developing relationships and getting that face time in especially in an industry where no one wants to identify themselves as in the comments posted here. I worked the show, I knew who I wanted to meet, who I needed to talk to and whom I didn’t. That all goes with knowing what I am after before I attend, it’s a little thing called planning.
Each person should come up with their own ROI calculation, from a mere financial perspective, if you are earning less than $50,000 from the domain industry, you may want to reconsider as essentially it will cost you 5% of your net revenue which is a huge expense if you cannot afford to bare it, some can, some cannot.
Now were there components of the show that sucked? Sure but I have yet to go to any show where some things didn’t suck. Did the auction suck? Yes. Who do you think suffered the most from it sucking? Rick & Howard did, as a large portion of their projected revenue comes from the auction, so regardless of what everyone thinks they have as just as much interest in it not sucking as every domain owner that submitted their names. Rest assured they tried however it is not as easy to bring end users to the table and have them fork over $100k+ for a domain name, as Owen mentioned he has been trying for 12 years. Did Test Track suck? Yes, it did. The format, the process, the “sharks”, yes but did they address it and say “We know it sucked and it will never happen again.” Yes, they did. Whether you believe it or not is up to you. I do and I believe in Rick and Howard’s ability and will be in attendance next year or whenever the next show is.
The point is, this is business and like any other business decision involving money there is risk involved. Calculate the risk, calculate the return and ask yourself, is it worth it? If it is not, then don’t take the risk. If so, then jump right in but do not be upset when you do not get the return you expected as you are the only one to blame for that.
Always available and open to further discussion.
Best regards,
Darren Cleveland
President/CEO
http://www.CityAdvertising.com
You respect someone for not name calling, but that’s all you’ve done in your earlier post. I’m done.
@melodramatic – So far you’ve done nothing but instigate false allegations, said my blog is only visited by me etc. etc. Grow up kid. I hope you weren’t abused at school because you’re showing signs of brain damage.
Mike
I been honored with both awards but don’t think I got there from kissing ass.
I do think writing the blog and getting in front of every issue in the industry is really important.
and don’t think I or Sahar or Ron Jackson would be in the hall without the power of the press.
For the record I nominated you on TheDomains.com for the Hall of Fame and have made the statement that you should have been one of the 1st five people voted in.
@MikeMann
“BTW, an incestuous industry with biased leadership doesnt expand our reach. What does one have to do to enter the Domainer Hall of Fame or Domainer of the Year, other than kiss some ass?”
I don’t always agree with Mike Mann, but in reality if he is not in the Domain Hall of Fame who deserves to be?
Mike is not only resting on what he has done in the past. He is active in the domain market today.
Brad
We ask for nominations and we count the votes. Nothing more, nothing less.
It’s insulting to say somebody kissed ass to get either. Plus it isn’t true.
@Mike Mann
Throw up a word press site devoted to agreeing with every single word uttered by rick and howard and focused on defending them while belittling anyone who has cause to speak against them and you’ll be in. Oh and a little ass kissing wouldn’t hurt either. For lessons check out elliots blog. Oh, btw how’s the missus?
I think Eric Constible does not like me. My first hater…
You have all contributed to the industry. Buyers are looking for value added assets not just domain names. Honestly, I think having some real websites that also had a killer domain name with it that was generating revenue may have added a new dynamic and brought more buyers.
My guess my opinion does not matter much, but the facts remain that website and blog sales are outpacing domains for large dollars.
I look forward to a possible Vegas TRAFFIC. It would be my first event ever. I think a lot of our perspectives would change if we were there.
Somebody had a good idea at the show to prevent anonymous morons from posting. Have everyone login with their Facebook account.
Rick
There are plenty of way to keep “anonymous morons” from posting but what fun would that be.
They do help me make my point. lol
I suggested the removal of blog troll posts to Mike earlier today. It will help maintain a discussion devoid of white noise and virtual “flashing”. Of course, it also lowers traffic numbers so I guess it’s a tough call.
Acro
It certainly would lower the entertainment value.
How about commenting on what worked and helpful comments on what could be differently?
Everybody is ignoring my salient points, and responding to the so-called trolls. Besides, if people use their real names like me and Frager did, they get killed. So, who can blame the anons?
BTW, MHB you’ve gotta tell me how to sell my .CO’s on Sedo or I’m going to stop blogging at your site!
Uzoma, I put my full name in here. My hater hid behind a phony name and link. I have to say, this post got a buttload of interest.
Yes, Bruce it’s the domainers way of congratulating the domainer of the year. Don’t worry about your antagonist, it’s the least of the problems.
We are all going to make a shit load of money once we work out the main kinks. My trouble is with the major players, all of them from Google to Sedo, to Godaddy…you name it. I intend to succeed in this thing whether they like it or not. We just have to figure out the way to go around all of them, if they don’t want to do the right thing. None of them are doing what they should be doing to have a transparent business environment. And YES I’m criticizing a lot, and I don’t plan to stop anytime soon.
I will say blogging and commenting with your real name helps you develop thick skin. Among all this chest pounding and name calling is actually some pretty good information. Opinion is never wrong, just the facts that were used to build it.
Mike
BIG UPS to you for not censoring the comments. It does provide entertainment value and at the same time keeps things somewhat real. I stopped reading Ricks blog when he started censoring the comments section effectively turning it into another one of his blow some more smoke up my ass and tell me what a great guy I am plays. Someone has to call these guys on their bullshit. Rick made some big statement along with some big promises about how HE would revolutionize the auction biz. He said he would be accountable and then his pal Howard blames the guys that paid them for failing to deliver buyers and they set out to destroy anyone who says that traffic was less than perfect. Are you fucking kidding me. Sorry, while there seems to be no end to the supply of suckers out there who are willing to pay money for the opportunity to rub up against these clowns not everyone in the world is drinking the cool aide. The notion that fortune 500 companies are going to flock to an auction where they can associate themselves with shemale, and ass fucking names is a tad naieve to say the least. I mean even the guys that OWN adult names didnt want to be seen at the auction as evidenced by a 3 hour broadcast which showed like three guys in the room. Yep that’s gonna be the spark Rick. Pour a couple gallons of gas on it and THEN it will be combustible Rick. Login via Facebook…you crack me up man. Almost as smart an idea as the no online bidding decision.
I could not attend Traffic this year for personal reasons, but I respect both Rick and Howard for what they have done. I started in 1998 and watched what they have done for many years.Whether you agree with them or not, they helped take this industry main-stream, they put in on the line, they go for it, they don’t stand on the sidelines, they don’t watch things happen, they make things happen.
For all these “arm-chair” QB’s standing on the “sidelines”, you have your opinions, but we do owe Rick, Howard, and others that paved the way some respect!!!
Jim
two points
The domain business is a LONG LONG way from being mainstream and
Respect is something that must be earned.
You repect them, good for you but there is a long long list of reasons why they may not have the respect of others
Big UPS +100
The adult content theme is a sign of desperation. The only audience still paying attention to these visionaries is the one that wants to buy shemale.com.
Classic.
“Behold my accomplishments. My biggest sale was [an adult domain name].”
That really says it all.
“Naive” is putting it lightly.
Good grief.
Imaginery:
MHB interviews Uzoma
MHB: Hello, Uzoma welcome to the program.
Uzoma: Howdy, Michael.
Why are you always bitching on my blog?
Uzoma: The weather is not clear, and…
MHB: I know that but, we are doing well at my company, we are selling names daily.
Uzoma: I was just going to say…
MHB: And, we registered tons of names many years ago, we have category killers.
Uzoma: I was …
MHB: This industry is rightfully controlled by the strong, and smart innovators there is.
Uzoma: Just a minute Berkens! Shut up and let me finish a sentence! It’s my turn to speak!! As far as I’m concerned, there’s only one guy who deserves an award in the domain industry. He is the most honest domainer there is; he is smart, fair, and unbelievably different from all the others. I have watched everybody. He is brutally sincere, and professional. Notice I didn’t say he is the most loquacious blogger out there ( Lord knows we have plenty of those, and most of them should shut down and become correspondents to one central blog, such as yours), notice I didn’t say he is the most powerful, or the most connected, I said he should be the only guy getting the lonely award that should have been given out this year, let’s call it “the domainer of award of everything 2011”; it’s not me; it’s not you; it’s not Elliot. I’m going to tell you who it is. By the way, this doesn’t take away from the other players in this industry, it’s just that nobody else deserves an award. The person who should be getting the award of everything is Eric Borgos of impulsecorp.com
If you are a newbie in this business, bookmark that site, and listen carefully to anything he says, because first of all, it’s the truth, and second of all, he will hold nothing back, and it’s a result of ardent research and science that he speaks from. If you are a seasoned domain professional, bookmark it as well because, then you’ll learn how to help others by giving accurate and complete information, with condescension.
MHB: Can I speak now?
Uzoma: Sure, after all it’s your blog.
MHB: Fine, this interview is fucking over already!
You know guys what is so strange to me about this “adult content theme” of TRAFFIC that I keep hearing about and was part of Owens post (which I didn’t really address in my post as it was getting pretty long) is that for 3 years every domainer was dying to go to the Playboy Mansion at Domainfest.
(which probably would still be on the agenda if not for the plague of last year)
I attended each year.
There were hundreds of women
Many of them were naked
I have pics
))::
There were dozens of girls on polls dancing.
Girls in the grotto.
I saw plenty of white powdery substances being consumed.
Yet I Didn’t hear anything but that it was a great time, everyone bragged about going to the Mansion, & posted pictures by the hundreds and couldn’t wait to go to it again next year.
Now at the .XXX party, not a naked girl, I didn’t see a breast, certainly not a nipple, there wasn’t even a poll in the room much less anyone dancing on one and yet this was a horrible reflection on the industry somehow and turned TRAFFIC into a porn convention according to some.
I also didn’t hear any bitching when adult domains were sold at previous TRAFFIC shows like porn.net and sex.net
Oh those were great sales, that everyone embraced and of course sex.com is still regarded by most to be the highest domain sale of all time and one every mentions when the topic of great domain sales comes up.
I’m just confused by it all.
Uzoma
If you wanted to Nominate Eric for an award you should have and should do so next year, this however just nominating him here isn’t going to do anyone, Eric the least of which any good.
Not to confuse you with facts but commodity.co which we just sold for $20K we bought LAST year for $100.
You could have bought it too.
Many of our sales come from domains recently purchased, domains other passed on in auctions like people passed on the other day.
Don’t bitch when orgy.xxx sells for six figures next year.
There were hundreds of women. Many of them were naked
There were dozens of girls on polls dancing. Girls in the grotto.
I saw plenty of white powdery substances being consumed.
———————————
They should put the hos and blow in their marketing materials. Would probably boost attendance.
Sounds like the auctions didnt go anywhere near what Rick Schwartz was selling.
But thats nothing new with him.
He left a trail of distruction in the adult industry over selling and under delivering
“high octane traffic”, by running an upfront payment scheme regardless of results (when the rest of the industry was running a commission only pay per sign up program), sold on the notion that he was a man of his word, the handshake crowd, and you would get a ticket to the in crowd because all of the big time traffic guys/the sponsors were his friend because they wanted him to send them traffic (but not after they pre paid for it and lost millions, they wanted him to join their commission programs like the rest of the industry, but of course he would only earn about 1/3 of what the going rate was, and so he found adult operators who were multi billing customer credit cards so they could pay ridiculous rates for his traffic.
Hes a scheister and will sell you a house and tell you its the taj mahal, and his blog is complete propoganda, editing posting fake posts etc.
correction: he would only earn a third of what he was charging
Some would say “that’s business” and some would say “he’s a scheister” and in different ways they are both right
Just dont ever hold him up to any gold standard
Wow!
Some of my observations – #1 maybe being the most incredibly obvious of them.
#1. Howard Neu introduced this show with the following words and promise: “Welcome everyone ….. Rick and I are only the facilitators of great minds meeting in this industry…So do what you do best”
2. The Key Note speaker session – Bill Kara ,(Michael Cyger interviewer) was one of the most inspiring talks I have ever heard — Was Bill a dynamic speaker?? No – He was one of the most boring speakers – I ever witnessed(Sorry Bill – He said it himself) — But again — I listened to every word he said — and this one session was worth my $5,000 investment to attend to this show.
3. Was I pissed my domain didn’t get into the auction ? Yes — I was slightly upset — My domain: MyOffer.com was arguably better than 50% or more of the domains being offered…(My opinion – may not be others)But both Rick and Howard made a decision and I knew their decision before buying my ticket and making a commitment to come down to Ft Lauderdale — (and I respected the decision)
Everyone has an opinion on domain auctions… Here is mine – Loud and Clear.
Domain auctions should be:
a. Entertaining
b. Filled with great domains on low, med and high end reserves
c. No longer than 2 hours total
d. The first domain that goes off – must , must , must , must SELL
I guarantee success if you take heed to these 4 pieces of advice —
4. Did I reconnect with people in a big way? YES – Because I chose to reach out and talk to people I normally would not have made a connection with..Would I have seen all these people in one place anywhere else? Absolutely not!
5. Did my TEST TRACK Session go perfect? No it didn’t — There are direct observations and corrections I would make before a next show — but the important thing is Howard and Rick are going to recognize my suggestions – and hell – maybe I will even moderate the next one. I even got a free web site out of it – courtesy of Adam Dicker.
6. Will I make money with the ideas shared and talked about at the show — YES ! – Why ? Because I desire to be inspired… It is me who desires the inspiration – therefore I seek inspiration. Seek and I will guarantee you will find…(That’s about a 1m year old lesson)
7. Are we all getting older – maybe crankier?? Yes – as I looked around the room – I could not help but notice how different our age demographic is from say what a FACEBOOK convention would be like —I say we can be the better for it – and most importantly embrace the new comers to the industry and the conference so that it endures in the future.
Lastly – Some of you know I have made a conscience decision to attend this TRAFFIC conference every other time and not everytime — This may change based on the outside variables/markets that many times we have no control of. But those of you that have HIGH Expectations and get upset that they are not met – should take that advice — Some people live at conferences and give and get- and some people try to find a life at conferences. Think about who you want to be….
Peace,
Kevin
I think you should kill the anonymous posters. I have no problem taking on scammers using my real name. If you have something valid to say why the need to hide?
Someone wanting their privacy or feeling the need to wear a mask doesn’t make their comment any less valuable to the conversation.
Do you really need to know who a person is to answer them?
WQ, That is ridiculous, they in fact have no credibility and cant be held to account for any falsehoods or other lameness they perpetuate, most of the lies and hate come anonymously
@john king
His business, like any of us here, is to do well. So he negotiated favourable terms while most didnt have that foresight and you point a finger? It sounds like you belong to the occupy movement, or should i just say socialism?
@ Mann,
You just don’t like what they had to say.
Why do you need to know who they are to consider them credible? I find that ridiculous.
This is the comment section of a blog.
I wonder what Yun Ye is upto nowadays?
WQ, you have stated the essential fact.
An informative comment is an informative comment. Some readers might not care about names, links to their websites, fonts or other such distractions.
They might just be reading the words to decipher the message.
“Don’t shoot the messenger.”
Focus on the message, not the messenger.
As an example, The WSJ deal blog is full of anonymous comments. Does that mean their Comments section is devoid of any useful information?
Many, many blogs have anonymous comments.
What about the anonymous investor forums? Or sites that collect information salaries? Or corporate rumour mills? Do these cause some grief for companies? Yes. Will they be abolished? Doubtful.
We’re about to see Google change it’s Plus policy on this issue. It might just be what gives them the crucial edge over the sell-out Facebook in so-called “social networking”. We shall see.
Information is information. Fact or opinion. Anonymous, or not. Elaborate, carefully crafted presentation or delivered raw.
Where the web is concerned, in every case, it still has to be evaluated by the reader.
“You know guys what is so strange to me about this “adult content theme” of TRAFFIC that I keep hearing about and was part of Owens post (which I didn’t really address in my post as it was getting pretty long) is that for 3 years every domainer was dying to go to the Playboy Mansion at Domainfest.
(which probably would still be on the agenda if not for the plague of last year)
I attended each year.
There were hundreds of women
Many of them were naked
I have pics
))::
There were dozens of girls on polls dancing.
Girls in the grotto.
I saw plenty of white powdery substances being consumed.
Yet I Didn’t hear anything but that it was a great time, everyone bragged about going to the Mansion, & posted pictures by the hundreds and couldn’t wait to go to it again next year.
Now at the .XXX party, not a naked girl, I didn’t see a breast, certainly not a nipple, there wasn’t even a poll in the room much less anyone dancing on one and yet this was a horrible reflection on the industry somehow and turned TRAFFIC into a porn convention according to some.”
So nobody said a word about Mike’s comment. Silence on this. Want to know why? Some have an agenda. Period. They can’t answer this. They ignore it instead. I hope you folks are proud that coke is being used openly during an industry trade show. And then folks talk about “Professionalism”? Oh please!! What idiots. What a double standard. What morons. PERIOD!
The better TRAFFIC does the more unhinged they become. But like Mike says, where else do you get entertainment like this? Stupid in action is FUN to watch. But they can never stay on topic or answer the real stuff.
btw, if you want REAL feedback on the phone bidding, then read it direct from somebody that actually used it. I think his comments have more weight than all others combined. Read why!!
http://nametalent.com/blog/?p=4796
I went to DomainFest for 4 straight years. The “playbody” mansion is overrated, maybe because I grew up in LA, and I been there numerous times, it’s no big deal.
I am not going back to DomainFest, because I don’t like how they treated Monte Cahn, who is one of the great guys in the industry, and who has done so much. Monte has done so much for this industry, he is one of the good guys, and I support him 100% with his case against them.
Thanks, Jim
Yea
I get it
Domainers should be allowed to veil their typo and infringing domain registrations With Whois privacy but should be prohibited from expressing their opinions anonymously
It is this kind of flawed logic that defines domaining
Two quotes from Mann’s posts here:
“Don’t shoot the messenger.”
“I think you should kill the anonymous posters.”
Thanks for the chuckle.
Do you think some trademark attorneys with reputable corporate clients, attorneys who can build their own reputation or maybe even “make bank” by suing brash but stupid domainers, are reading about these drug and nudity-filled “conferences” and taking notes?
Keep on bragging.
”
His business, like any of us here, is to do well. So he negotiated favourable terms while most didnt have that foresight and you point a finger? It sounds like you belong to the occupy movement, or should i just say socialism?
”
oppseeker
I understand your point of view.
But the people who lost millions to him dont share the same view.
Because they bought his “high octance traffic sales pitch/type in raffic” and “only work with people you can trust on a hand shake” and “i only accept pre payment” and “come back when its worth it” and blabla and surrounding himself with the industry leaders/the in club (just like hes doing in the domain industry all made possible because he got lucky early on) and if you fall out with him you fall out with them (because they all want his traffic or to be in the in club, but they all found out after paying for it upfront and losing, but they still wanted him to join their afiliate programs on commission the way the rest of the industry operated, but he wouldnt do that because it meant both parties would win, instead he was running a sales scheme that ripped off many private businesses buying the traffic on his “high octance traffic promise/sales spiel spread across the boards day after day” which lost private companies a combined mllions of dollars and made him millions of dollars
And the adult industry doesnt work on branding (it only works on profit), win win profitable relationships, and in the end he was selling his traffic to operators who were multi billing customers credit cards/the mob
You might think this is just business, And some might think hes a scheister, but whatever you do dont ever trust him.
The TRAFFIC domain auction is a perfect example of how Rick Schwartz works
Sure he has to promote it, but he was talking bullshit overhyping an ordinary list of domain names with a few exceptions and everybody in the know knew it
He declared at least 50% of the domain names would sell using a bunch of newbies who ticked a box on mikes blog as his reasoning (amongst all of the other intricate factors only he could quantify
But it didnt work because the only crowd in attendance were experienced domainers (they already knew it was bullshit), and im guessing less than 10% of the domain names being touted as an amazing opportunity didnt sell, because there werent any newbies there with big pockets buying the dream (or as domainers like to eloquently call them “end users”
Its just how he works and he is a bad spokesperson/representative for the domain name industry
Rick Schwartz = Caveat emptor
”
he is a bad spokesperson/representative for the domain name industry
”
This is arguable..
He does dirty work for the industry which may or may not benefit domainers
And he makes it look like a cult of dreamers/bullshitters
“There were hundreds of women
Many of them were naked
I have pics
))::
There were dozens of girls on polls dancing.
Girls in the grotto.
I saw plenty of white powdery substances being consumed.”
-> not sure if I read it right but are people saying this is a bad thing?? 🙂
Do you think there are trademark counsel with large corporate clients who are reading about these drug and nudity-filled “conferences” and taking notes? This behaviour might just make it all that much easier to portray domaining as an illicit business.
Indeed for some it is. But not for all.
Maybe some domainers are not anything like these attendees? Maybe some domainers do not seek attention. Maybe they don’t need to find “end users” in order to be successful.
One domainer comes to mind who owns far more domains than any of them. Was he at these conferences?
Do these other domainers suffer from the public image attached to domaining that is perpetuated by the acts of a small number of “industry leaders”?
Answers are welcome.
Agreed Nom, domainers dont need “end users/newbies” to be successful
But you cant teach old dogs new tricks, and Ricks been operating like this for a long time, he did the same thing in adult
John, don’t waste breath trying to explain it. Everyone sees it.
For his talk about seeing customers as they see themselves, Rick Schwartz is unable to see him as others see him. The only people who accord him any respect are a few old time domainers who acknowledge his presence early on, and stupid newbies who aren’t intelligent enough to comprehend the man for what he truly is.
His personality cult is a sad affair. He creates all manner of groups and clubs and associations, names himself in some chief role, then purports it to be a highly exclusive affair limited only to those who are “real domainers”, as defined by their willingness to pay thousands of usd to attend his conferences, or his laughable “app”. The only thing sadder is that it isn’t just crass marketing… He truly believes he has some sort of preeminent role. He is a flawless case of megalomania.
Unbelievable! Only in domaining land is the girl (LindaM) making the men blush! Go Linda!
Bergstrom, Rick Schwartz reminds me of Bernie Madoff, same sort of exclusive inner sanctum club sales approach, ask no questions or your out style and we all know how that turned out. Here’s a copy of his latest post on his blog promoting their app:
”
The app will segregate the domain industry and put some of those undesirables out in the cold. That way serious folks can focus on serious business and not be interrupted by clowns that make things up and remain faceless and nameless. That was the one thing most attending TRAFFIC have in common. They are allergic to the noise and bullshit in what appears to be jealous failures of the domain industry
If folks want something for free or think they are entitled…..they should go Occupy Wall Street. There is no room for that in real business. In the domain industry. In life.
”
Well Rick by most peoples standards, including successful people who worked hard and smart for their success, you got your ride easy. Well done, but if you want anymore applause than that you’re barking up the wrong tree because EVERY entrepreneur is out on the field, working hard, trieing to achieve something, risking money, and you were just in the right place at the right time, so come back to earth and stop preaching from such lofty heights, which you dont deserve and are as mentioned only awarded by a few early domainers and bunch of newbies (and b.t.w imo the early domainers only stick with him because he’s largely doing their dirty work for them, but im not sure this is the right strategy going forward, maybe in the early days, but not now.
Maybe im wrong, maybe his approach is at least getting heard by people.
But what are people hearing??
Hopefully they’re able to hear through the noise (obviously by the crickets i can hear about the auction results they didnt get sucked in), but if the so called “domain king” supported by the top domainers is going around promoting a list of incredible domain name opportunities which at best were ordinary, what message is being sent..
Obviously when you read between the lines there are a lot of frustrated people in this world as it relates to domains and the Internet – clearly some venting on and cluttering up this thread.
In my case it was all put in front of me in late 1993 and went right over my head until the late 90’s – I still remember a former business partner telling me in 1993 there was this “business where multi billions of dollars have been invested in it – and these .com things – yet no one has yet to make a single dollar”.
Do not try to do what Rick, Roy Flanders, Rob Grant, Mickey and other pioneers did – you WILL lose – play the build out brand business.
Do not step on someone elses vision – create your own
Brian Im not stepping on someone elses vision.
I saw the video rick did with domainsherpa i think its called and thought “wow i would have normally been impressed with this guy”
Im just giving people the other side of the story, take it or leave it
Hey Jo King!!
You got your facts wrong. Dean Shannon bought ALL my adult traffic for 6 YEARS exclusively. I had the most sought after adult traffic because it closed more sales than any other traffic of that time. At shows, if he even saw somebody talking to me about traffic he let his presence known.
So sounds like you have a hair up your ass. Actually you just sound like a very jealous ass. The more time you lose out of your own pathetic life attacking me must prove you have no life. I am glad I am IN YOUR HEAD!! That’s the only satisfaction. No matter what alias you use. I am in your head. Ha Ha!!
All of the energy used in the hundreds of comments here if used to team and brainstorm for a better industry were used, think of the improvements we can make. I am no price and most people could give a crap I have been in this game for 15-years. I don;t attend shows or advertise myself. However, I did spend 30-years in executive management for pharma companies before I took my net business from part-time to full-time and success was gained by teamwork.
So far, I have seen a lot of Rick bashing. He held an auction and event with some new strategies. I for one, applaud him for trying something new instead of the same old la-ta-da. Although the .xxx names were on auction in this event does not mean it was filled with nudity. Companies are not wasting their time viewing the feed to TRAFFIC. They are interested in firm numbers that support ROI on their return.
Looking at all of the Brain Power in thse posts, it appears if you teamed up you would be a force to reckoned with. Instead, hours have been spent beating Rick and Owen up. I don;t know either of these folks personally, but I do know they care or they would not even be in the industry.
Rick was not in the right place at the right time, he saw a vision and took risks. He made millions and that is what we all want to do. So how is he just hype like everyone keeps saying. Look back through the years, he has added value to the industry. If not for some of his sales, many would have never entered into domaining, His high dollar sales intrigued many enough to enter the business and this buy domain names.
The original point to this post was about Owen’s title and content. He has a right to post what he thinks. That is where my issue comes in… DO NOT punish the man for speaking his mind and sharing his opinion. If anything, a conversation should have taken place trying to find out why Owen felt that way, not roasting the man over a fire pit. Owen is a good guy and he should not have to endure slings and arrows for being a guy that had an opinion different than the organizers of the event.
I have managed events of 1,000+ and let me tell you it is a hell of a lot of work to pull it off. So to all who put TRAFFIC together, thanks for the hard work. One last suggestion, hold at least one conference in Chicago will ya? You are missing the mid-west market and Chicago is filled with investors if you catch my drift.
Luckily no one listens to what Owen Frager has to say. He has to close down comments on his blog because he gets so much negatives comments. What has Owen Frager done in the domain industry? Nothing. He lists his domains for sale on his blog that are crap, but thinks they are highly brandable gems. When was Owen’s last big domain sale? I think he is a fringe player that wants to give the impression he is in the know. What a doofus.
BRJ- if no one listens to Owen Frager why are you here?
Why did a man of Mike’s stature feel a need to acknowledge and comment on the post if no one would listen?
What has Owen Frager done in the domain industry? Well ow about wiring a creative headline to got huge amounts of attention onto a subject most of the same audience. The audience I create migrated to this blog, Elliot’s blog, Domain Gang, Shane, Ron Jackson and others resulting in a combined 100K p;us page views from what I was the catalyst for. Not to mention Domaining.com who used all four of these stories in his news letter as “link bait” to drive his highest day ever. If no one listens to Owen Frager how could that happen. Many say domaining.com should ban me. They argue 90 people, the most of any blog filter me. But 29,910 people don’t. How many in the first group make over $100K a year and are running real businesses. I can tell you from the second group the top 50 well known people in the biz that fit the bill listen regular. The “crap” domains listed on my blog are owned by Frank Schilling. I only broker them. My last big sale can be found by Googling me as anyone else can. I covered all this earlier in this thread to respond to similar bas less charges from people who have no facts. I’ve sold about 1 domain a year to an end user who finds me from who is. I think this is more than Rick Schwartz has sold. They average 20K each. MY first sale was to a large market research company who purchased your2cents.com for $25K. MY most recent sales war just two months aho, a LLL.co bought at goDaddy for $895 and flipped to a client of the same initials for 30K. I also sold a name to a guy from Spain who called me at home from the # on the whois. They are large global bank who chose my name to brand their financial trading software. The sale, under non-disclosure, was more than my average but less then the .co.
excuse tupos
Let me fix the typos and omissions
What has Owen Frager done in the domain industry? Well how about wiring a creative headline to got huge amounts of attention onto a subject most of the same audience would never pay attention to or have already written off. The audience I created migrated to this blog, Elliot’s blog, Domain Gang, Shane, Ron Jackson and others resulting in a combined 100K plus page views from what I was the catalyst for. Not to mention Domaining.com who used all four of these stories in his news letter as “link bait” to drive his highest day ever. If no one listens to Owen Frager how could that happen?
writing
If everyone is using Owens name he must be doing something right, thats my theory anyhow, attention not forgotten is better for business.
When you are talking about “Mike” in the domain industry I think you should use a last name.
I like Ricks idea of only allowing people to login from their facebook accounts. That would allow guys like Mike Mann to login from various accounts. Oh wait, Mike lost all his facebook domain names in a WIPO complaint. Ooops. WTF Mike Mann for domainer of the year anyways AND the domain name hall of fame too!
Added for credibility due to the anonymous nature of this post:
Facebook, Inc. v. Domain Asset Holdings Case No. D2011-0516
Why beat a man up for stating his opinion. The man has freedom of speech in this country. Stop slamming Owen for speaking his mind. I was surprised that 30,000 domainers come through domaining.com. That is a buttload of people for a small industry.
Owen, I respect your fortitude to write what you think and feel. As for the auction, new things were tried and either pro or con, you have to step out and take risks. I applaud Rick and Howard for being involved to the extent they are. They could easily take their cash and go sit on an island somewhere and say to hell with domain name owners. Instead, they keep the industry in the spotlight whether it is a good or bad time for the industry. I honestly think we need to understand that the global economy is kicking the crap out of every industry. It had to hit domains at some point. Names still sell but they sell at very reduced prices.
Anonymous scammer idiots, please see http://AppliedEvolution.com/ to understand your own lameness.
“you got your facts wrong. Dean Shannon bought ALL my adult traffic for 6 YEARS exclusively. I had the most sought after adult traffic because it closed more sales than any other traffic of that time. At shows, if he even saw somebody talking to me about traffic he let his presence known.
”
Dean Shannon was the only one left who could afford your traffic (and theres a reason, see below) after you ripped everybody else off with your “over sold” “over hyped” “high octane traffic” be “part of the in club, the hand shake club/the industry movers club” pre paid sales scheme (while the standard industry model was pay per sign up, where everybody won, not just you, because paying for loss making traffic/branding meant nothing in the online adult industry).
And the only reason he could pay/average around $70 per sign up (compared to the industry average at the time, $35) is because he was illegally multi billing customer credit cards, off the back of a publicly listed company in Australia (asc) and drove the price up to around 40c a share; followed by news they were about to lose their merchant account and he sold his shares for millions. Then, within a week or two after Dean sold his shares, the merchant account was cancelled and the shares plummetted to around 5c, costing shareholders millions of dollars. This is another scheme you were part of which cost people millions of dollars.
And even though Dean is a fat slob, it wouldnt surprise me if he was trieing to shield you off the back of his reputation as part of the Aussie porn mafia.
But in reality this is just another story, eg couldnt someone call you, email you, write to you, visit, darn bullshit artist.
Suddenly my rants dont seem so inflammatory
“Vendors in booths with nothing to offer.”
Just thought I’d reply to this by saying that I don’t recall Owen coming to our ParkLogic booth during the conference which I think is a shame. It was our first time having a booth at T.R.A.F.F.I.C. and as a result we had a lot of people who were not only interested in finding out about our services and what we have to offer that is innovative and new, but they even signed up with us. I invite Owen to our booth for a Demonstration at the next conference that we are both attending. Alternatively, he can simply contact us and I would be more than happy to do that over the phone.
As far as Howard and Barbara Neu and also Rick and Alina Schwartz are concerned – they did a great job and should be congratulated. I’ve run conferences before and know what it’s like juggling every decision and managing every expectation. It’s a lot of work. So well done to each of them and their whole team. I am sure that there are things that you would have like to have gone better, even with the best laid plans there are always things to improve upon. But after getting to know you all, I am sure that I can say that I know you will endeavor to continue to do your best at future conferences. After all, that is all anyone can really ask of you.
I havent attended a domain conference. I do try to keep up on the happenings. I just want to say to John King. If you are so smart, why werent you supplying your infinite wisdom about how this supposed failure was to be BEFORE the event. My impression is that your a Monday morning QB. You appear to be a Johnny com lately who is full of envy. I have been in the namespace for 13 years. Why havent I heard of you? And did I just see you try to interject politics into a domain board? Get a fucking life due. Go to Hotair for that shit or maybe your a Kosovite but not here. I see by your inflammatory remarks you are trying to make a name for yourself but the one that pops into my mind immediately is LOSER.
Dont shoot the true messenger, do kill the anonymous scammer posters
I might agree with you Mike, but how do I know your Mike???
for one it has my name, email and url, MikeMann.com, the one and only, check it out
Mr. Mann. What constitutes a scammer poster? Is it true that your company was associated with registering facebook names as one annon said? If so, it is YOU sir that is the scammer.
A very inconvenient truth!
its true that I gave facebook great generic names for free and lost nothing in court, and haters anonymously post lies and conjecture who cant be held to account, most people talking crap about me anonymously I fired for gross incompetence or lost out on deals somewhere along the line, or just cant compete in general, use their names or get them away
“its true that I gave facebook great generic names for free and lost nothing in court”
Interesting viewpoint.
Here is a link to the dispute –
http://www.wipo.int/amc/en/domains/search/text.jsp?case=D2011-0516
Brad
Oh so the anonymous post was true
No lies
No conjecture
No scam
NO PROBLEM!
Here we go gang. We didn’t have to wait long for someone using thier real name to make a non credible comment! Oh and it was Mike Mann. Shocker!
Mike Mann (real name?) “I gave ” facebook the domains”
HUH?
The fact is that the name transfer was ORDERED. It was no gift. They had to pay $ to get the names from you. If you call this giving I think we need to take a closer look at your charitable work! You didn’t even have the balls to respond to the filing Mike so care to tell us all how you arranged the delivery of the GIFT you GAVE them
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL. Priceless.
Mike Mann just lost TrainingChannel.com http://www.wipo.int/amc/en/domains/search/text.jsp?case=D2011-0875
– is my WealthChannel.com next ? – Sure the facebook stuff I would not have touched – Maybe Mike Mann had an issue with them – or whatever – I do not even have a fucking facebook account.
But what about the demand letter facebook sent me 3 years ago for FaithBook.com – a domain I reserved in 2001 – long before facebook even existed – not a word since from those losers – it is all posturing to make you masked “research” geniuses feel good about giving up your rights in a free society.
Good god my 5 year old now knows how to look up all the “dirt” on me from 10 years ago – BFD. Someone that hides themselves on a thread has a hell of a lot more to hide than industry pioneer Mike Mann – karma baby