Someone needs to say it.
The experiment has failed, TRAFFIC needs to go back to a one live auction, per show format.
Back when The TRAFFIC organizers announced that several live auctions would be held at the same show, I voiced my opinion that this would not increase the total sales or help the auctions, or the show for that matter, be successful.
Why?
Two reasons.
First, multiple auctions at the same event is not going to mean more overall sales. We said back last July, that domain show auctions are a zero sum game (if you missed that post you can read it here). Basically domainers, like every other sensible businessmen, only has so much to spend at one time, so having more opportunities to spent money, does not mean people will just increase their budget. I said it was much more likely that people would spent just as much as they would at one auction, but spreading that amount over 2 or 3 auctions, just spending less at each.
Secondly, and more importantly, when the multiple auction format was announced, we asked in a blog post, “Where are all these good, well priced domains going to come from?”. If you missed this post, from back on July 14th of last year, you can read it by clicking here.
As we said at the time, there are only so many good, well priced domains, available at any given time and holding multiple live auctions at the same event will only insure that those few names get split up amongst the auctions, making for a few weak auctions, instead of one killer one.
Now after a couple of shows the results speak volumes; more is not better.
It’s time for TRAFFIC to go back to one major live auction, rather than 2 or 3.
Obviously, based on results from the past shows, Moniker.com should be running that auction.
Want to see a telling comment from Tony, one of the reader of my blog yesterday:
“”””The take home message is buy at Rick’s, sell at Moniker.”””
No one can think that the continuation of multiple auctions where one is getting the reputation of being a buyers auction, and the other a seller’s auction can be good for the industry.
I’m sure this will piss off some people, but as my Aunt Phyllis, who just celebrated her 80th birthday always says:
“True is True”.
1 auction per show is enough.
Michael – You are very right and well said.
Mike,
Couldn’t you make that same argument about all the other shows that have now put in an auction where there was none before? Remember a time there were only 2 live auctions a year? How many are now?
But this is something we are going to listen to feedback from. Obviously we have contractual obligations that we have to honor.
It was an experiment. Having multiple auctions created competition and some excitement. I think Moniker proved they were the folks to beat and nobody beat them. That’s not a bad thing. Moniker raised their game and the results this week proved it. Keep in mind, just one sale off of each, one sale added to each, could have changed things dramatically.
Different auctions have different styles. Howard and I value your opinion and we will read the various responses. But I did want to put in the equation all the other auctions that have popped up and the effect that has as well. I can’t even count them all.
But as always, it is the trail that Howard and I blazed that everyone has copied. That really is the bottom line here. I believe that has done more to water down the market than our 2 auctions. Staying one step ahead requires taking risk. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. Plus you have to add in the economic times. Had we done this earlier, the results may have been much more dramatic. As things get worse or things improve, so could the auctions.
That said I would think New York may be the last show with more than one auction. But it won’t be me that decides that. The folks will. So we will read the comments here and listen to all ways we can improve as we do after each show. We have some HUGE surprises coming in 2010 that we will announce in New York. More things for folks to copy as Howard and I trail blaze and go where none have gone before. THAT is what we do. Thanks for the posts and thoughts and see you guys at Bova when we all get back!
If one auction is a buyers marketplace and another a sellers, then all that means is there are some personal biases and disproves the purpose of multiple auctions, because a domain is a domain. I like the idea of multiple auctions, no matter who is the auctioneer. It keeps everyone on their toes. There is no doubt Moniker had many better domains at better reserves but If I’m not mistaken their last few show results before this announcement were very poor. If they are the only game in town, maybe they will go back to their old ways of what seemed to be little work, with mediocre results. This auction proved to be harder work and better results.
I havent been to Traffic so it might not seem fair with myself making a comment but here are my thoughts.
This experiment might have worked in a different climate i.e. If people were actually spending there cash.
The sales from the auction are nothing like the past and I dont put that down too having two auctions just the climate with ppc down and people choosing to develop what they already own etc
But again do we need two seperate auctions at the same place? I would say no
I think it has helped as more quality names have come through at great prices but we really dont want one auction know as a buyer and another as a seller
Is there a way for Traffic to Run the auction? partner Rick Latona and Moniker on a joint auction – Joint commission – Joint inventory?
I dont know just my thoughts . . .
As I was reading your thread, a number of points came to mind.
Ironically, Rick commented on the points I was going to make.
Jody and I were also thinking along the same line of thought.
It is good to see Moniker improved over the past couple auctions.
However, 5,000 domains ???
All that does is dilute the selling results of the premium domains being offered.
It is a balancing act Moniker needs to take into consideration.
Why submit a premium domain and end up selling it wholesale or below wholesale? Plus, tie up the domain with Moniker for 3 to 6 months?
Ad.com is outlier.
I guess the next big auction will be Domain Roundtable.
But, in the past, they were not in the same league as Traffic.
The one major problem that needs to be overcome is the lack of bidders from outside our industry.
The auctions are still “domainer to domainer” sales.
Rick,
Yes, I believe the other shows also have an incredible burden on the growth of Moniker’s Traffic. The economy is obviously a factor but the more auctions we add (as an industry) the more buyers stop looking at lists with such detail and the exclusivity or rarity factor for waiting to buy at those 2 or 3 events slowly gets a little less exclusive so interest fades a bit. Many times auctions start and we do not even look at the lists – why, it’s just another auction, there will be one again next month.
You guys are the architects behind these conventions and very few (less than a handful provide as much value – and the auctions, maybe one other place has any kind of comparable power for live sales (DomainFest). It’s impressive to see numbers and sell through rates at your live auctions stay on par and sometimes get better in this state of a world we are in at the moment and it’s nice to see you and Howard considering some of the points. Where is that loud rant of yours ha ha.
My only advice is that the industry wants buyers – so convention planners must hire or coordinate efforts to get more end users for domains, possibly provide custom marketing tools for domainers (since those who have no idea how to develop quite possibly have no idea how to market properly) – As the premier auction house people look up to your conference for results which provide market indicators for where we are at a point in time and although the cost of attending is well worth it some may also view more value if selling tools were provided.
With that said, your responsibility is the event – the platform and not necessarily bringing 1,000 end users to the conference. Providing tools for domainers to market domains is in added bonus that can be done with very little cost – how do you sell domains? Take a piece of that, ask who are the big sellers around you may not know about – take a few tips from them and so on. Its not about giving secrets away but providing some selective information – real information – where people will have more tools to sell their inventory since right now many have a product but still have no idea what to do except submit the name to Moniker.
I think you guys do a fantastic job and credit must be given to people who started this model, those who continue to make it happen every year and those are willing to listen to the community. Your interest is also my interest – the INDUSTRY 10 years from now, not what name I’m going to sell tomorrow to pay rent. Agree to disagree on somethings but you have my respect.
If you even want to chat ask Monte or Mike – I have other thoughts but that enough posting for today – they know where to find me
Alan
Domain Investor
5,000 domains is a lot but just a fraction of the domains that drop everyday.
If you want a shorter list of the best domains out of the 5,000 we have done the work for you.
Check out our post:
http://www.thedomains.com/2009/04/29/our-picks-from-the-moniker-slient-auction/
Rick
As you know I great admire you and Howard for being an industry leader.
As far as your statement:
“”Couldn’t you make that same argument about all the other shows that have now put in an auction where there was none before? Remember a time there were only 2 live auctions a year? How many are now?””
Other than DomainFest, another Moniker run auction, none of the other shows have made an impact on TRAFFIC.
However, you can’t do anything about these shows, or controlling the number of auctions others put on, only you own.
I think the excitement and anticipation of having one big auction get diluted in your own show by having more than 1 auction.
Nothing wrong with having tried it, but the results speak for themselves.
Having said that, you guys are some of the smartest guys I know and you will make the right call, just wanted to start a discussion.
Have a great time on your trip and we will do it up in Bova when we are all back in town.
As a previous poster mentioned, the Real Problem is:
The lack of bidders from outside our industry!
The auctions are still “domainer to domainer” sales!
Everything else under the sun can be argued about, changed, tweaked, un-tweaked and re-tweaked. There could be an auction every morning and every night. There could be sexy cheerleaders passing out free Mint Juleps and Martinis during the auctions. There could be a Win a Free Premium Domain contest. And, the list of goodies and promotions could go on forever.
But, getting beyond the domainer to domainer churning is what has to happen for All Hell to Break Loose Big Time. Things absolutely Must get outside the circle of domianers.
Whoever does that will change the domain industry forever …more than any of us could have ever imagined in our wildest dreams.
Just to supplement what Rick said — Kudos go to Monte and his staff at MONIKER for getting an end user involved in the bidding for Ad.com. THAT’S what made the auction exciting. Additionally, they had a great auctioneer who had a knack of exciting the audience as well as the auctioneer’s son who was the bid spotter and did a fantastic job.
Having said that, the problem with the Latona auction was that the auctioneer did not connect with the audience as well though there were some very good domains in the mix. Both auctions had a good mix of high, medium and low priced domains that sold. The % of domains sold at both auctions was high.
Mike, we love you, but you weren’t there to see the dynamics or understand the backgrounds of buyers and sellers that were involved. Nobody knew that Divyank was that interested in the one big domain to sell in creating the excitement of a really good auction. I give credit to both auction houses in their attempts (some successful, some not) in reaching out to end users on category killer domains.
Between the 2 live auctions, over $2,500,000 was sold, an amount not approached by any single auction in some time. The next conference, T.R.A.F.F.I.C. ccTLDs in Amsterdam will have just one auction. The conference by Roundtable will have just one auction. We WILL have 2 auctions in New York at T.R.A.F.F.I.C. NEW YORK in October and we know that both auction houses will be doing their homework to make them the biggest successes of the year. We hope to see you, Mike, and Judith there bidding on some really good domains.
Howard,
For the record – Ad.com was a great buy and great sale for the auction and the industry however using them as an example is almost bypassing the point of what many domainers keep repeating over and over – more end users.
Directi owns Skenzo.com and many other industry products. An enduser within the industry – whether its Directi buying Ad.com or Monte buying Domains.com or Rick buying auctions.com – is not an example of reaching out to main street and bringing end users in. Its still a sale to people we all know of.
You guys do a great job but using Directi as an example (regardless if they spent $10m) is really not what most are thinking about imo so I think that’s where a lot of frustration lies where not everybody is looking at this from the same viewpoint.
Best of luck.
Howard
Just to let you know even though we weren’t at the show we did pick up 6 domains and spent over $40K, sold one domain for $18K and got outbid on several others, so we were pretty active.
I have stated this point all along….now and previously was not the time to throw multiple auctions into the mix at these shows. I love Rick and Howard and have worked with them now for years so I have the highest respect for them and what they have created. With that said, we have all made mistakes and learned from those mistakes to make things better. Now is the time to get back to serious business and stop playing around. I heard 50+ people tell me the same at the conference that there should be one auction provider and I think we demonstrated our leadership position again and again.
Yes we did have auctions in different environments…some were successful and some were not, but we took that gamble and learned the lessons and paid the prices to do that. We shielded many from loosing money by experimenting with different formats, different auctioneers, different venues and industries. We will go back to fewer live auctions and more online themed events through what SnapNames is already doing very successfully. We sell 1000+ names per day and that by far out performs every and all others combined. You will begin to see more integration between Snapnames and Moniker to make these online events more successful in the very near future and as I predicted, there will be more activity and more bidding on the extended auctions after the live events. I expect that the extended auction will do quite well due to how many quality names are in the mix and how many more end user buyers we now have. I estimate that out of the 91 names sold at our Moniker Auction at TRAFFIC that 20+ were end users and corporates buying names – this is a great achievement of my staff and their efforts along with those outside that have helped consult with us.
The Moniker Auction at TRAFFIC was just what the industry needed to be reassured that domains are true assets with good value in up markets and in down markets. That owners can still turn a nice profit on domains when most other assets cannot be liquidated unless they are foreclosed on.
We will continue to work hard to make all of our events and sales as successful as we can whether times are good or times are bad.
Thank you all for your support and positive feedback.
Well said Monte!
Alan
I wasn’t referring to Diredti when I said that there was an end user bidding. It was the people bidding by phone AGAINST Directi who were legitimate end users and wanted to be able to compete with Advertising.com.
Monte
I believe that it was the COMPETITION that led you to present more favorable contracts to the sellers, get a better mix of domains into the auction and obtain a top-notch auctioneer to make your success possible. Competition is always healthy for an industry. Don’t you think that Rick and I would love to go back to being the only “show in town”?
Where else can you see industry leaders be constructive and collaborate on key issues to make the industry better for domain buyers and sellers, at thedomains.com of course?
TheDomains.com: 15 minutes could save you 15% or more on domain names.
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2 auctions at one event is kind of weird.
that’s just like having 2 football games back to back in the same stadium.
I would state that learning what worked and what did not and receiving feedback helped more than any competition scenario Howard, but its fine if we all want to use it. Now that it is being and has been addressed, I think you here a very clear message on what works now.
I also would not look at how auctions help save 15% on commission but how participating in sales through auctions and other can make you more and be well worth the commissions you pay. Never look at the commissions, look at the results and how much money you can make. I believe we earn every penny we make for all concerned….and then some. We and TRAFFIC as well as our parent company have gone well beyond the realm and scope of what one may think will work or has worked in the past. There is more time, energy, and money invested in this than any of you even know…..and I can speak for myself as one that has dedicated my entire life since the mid ninety’s to contribute to the success of this industry on many fronts – registrar, monetization, domain escrow, appraisals, brokerage and auctions. Many of you have done the same and that is why we have an industry that one day we can have our children and our childrens children and friends participate in…and reap the rewards from!